| Author |
|
sriv94
MusicFan
Joined: 16 September 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1457
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 11:00am | IP Logged
|
|
|
A million years ago, when the Sony multi-disc Soundtrack for a Century came out, I remember E-mailing Pat about the versions used to create some of the discs. On one of them is a version of Kansas' "Carry On Wayward Son." It's an edit, but according to Pat's E-mail to me Sony made at least one editing error in their attempt to create the 45 (it's listed as "neither the 45 or LP version" in the database).
Anybody know the error and whether the 45 can be extracted from the LP? From my recollection of the single being played on pop radio in 1977, I think the error(s) occur(s) toward the end, but I'm not positive.
Thanks as always.
Edited by sriv94 on 02 December 2005 at 11:02am
__________________
Doug
---------------
All of the good signatures have been taken.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
aaronk
Admin Group
Joined: 16 January 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6513
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 11:11am | IP Logged
|
|
|
I might be able to help you out with that one, Doug. I'm doing some editing for edtop40, and he has sent me both the LP version and a dub of the actual 45. I'll work on it and report back my findings shortly.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
aaronk
Admin Group
Joined: 16 January 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6513
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 11:56am | IP Logged
|
|
|
OK, to answer your question: No, the LP version cannot be used to create the 45 version. I was successful in matching all of the edits, but the 45 is not just edited but also remixed. The vocals on the LP have quite a bit of reverb, whereas the vocals on the 45 have far less reverb and a slight delay added to them. Also, there's some differences in the way the instruments are mixed, too.
I would be curious to know if the cd's with "neither" have the LP mix or the 45 mix.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
sriv94
MusicFan
Joined: 16 September 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1457
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 1:16pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Not sure about the mix (I'm not home right now), but thanks for the valient effort.
You were able to match the edits, though. If I sent you a copy of the edit, you could a) tell me how close the edits on the actual CD were to being right, and b) judge the mix.
Unless someone beats me to it, I'll get it to you sometime tonight.
__________________
Doug
---------------
All of the good signatures have been taken.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Roscoe
MusicFan
Joined: 18 July 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 333
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 2:01pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
aaronk wrote:
OK, to answer your question: No, the LP version cannot be used to create the 45 version. I was successful in matching all of the edits, but the 45 is not just edited but also remixed. The vocals on the LP have quite a bit of reverb, whereas the vocals on the 45 have far less reverb and a slight delay added to them. Also, there's some differences in the way the instruments are mixed, too.
I would be curious to know if the cd's with "neither" have the LP mix or the 45 mix. |
|
|
Which CD did you use as the LP version starting point? Because there was a remix of Carry On done in the 80s that showed up on the first CD issue of Best of Kansas. This remix added alot of reverb to the vocals.
The remaster of Best of Kansas utilized the original mix. I haven't listened to the 45 in ages, but I thought I remembered the 45 mix sounding the same as the original LP mix. Could be wrong though.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Brian W.
MusicFan
Joined: 13 October 2004
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2507
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 2:35pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Damn, a THIRD instance of Sony editing the the wrong mix to match the 45, and getting it wrong! Who the hell is running A&R at that stupid company, Bozo the Clown?!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
aaronk
Admin Group
Joined: 16 January 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6513
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 8:16pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Roscoe, this gives me hope that I might have been using a "remixed" version, because my source for editing was Best Of Kansas. Edtop40 supplied the source, so maybe he can say whether it was the original or remastered version. If I had to guess, I'd say it was an original pressing. That being the case, we might be able to re-create the 45 version by editing a non-remixed version.
Does anyone have two different mixes of this song on CD? Perhaps Pat made an error in the database for the listing of "Carry On" on Best Of Kansas. I don't have another source to compare, but based on Roscoe's description, the version I have does have a ton of reverb.
Edited by aaronk on 02 December 2005 at 8:17pm
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
aaronk
Admin Group
Joined: 16 January 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6513
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 8:20pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
UPDATE: I just pulled out my cassette copy of Best Of Kansas, and it does say "remixed for this album" in the liner notes next to "Carry On."
Pat, you should probably update your database with this new information.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
sriv94
MusicFan
Joined: 16 September 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1457
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 8:34pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
aaronk wrote:
| Does anyone have two different mixes of this song on CD? Perhaps Pat made an error in the database for the listing of "Carry On" on Best Of Kansas. I don't have another source to compare, but based on Roscoe's description, the version I have does have a ton of reverb. |
|
|
I have three CDs that the LP version appears on--the Best Of CD (prolly the original pressing; I got it a long while ago), the Time-Life AM Heavy Hits compilation and the Realm Flashback CD. The question is do either of the other two CDs I have it on contain the original mix.
__________________
Doug
---------------
All of the good signatures have been taken.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
aaronk
Admin Group
Joined: 16 January 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6513
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 8:58pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Doug just sent me a copy of the version on Train Kept A Rollin', and this is the correct MIX. Actually, they only goofed in two places. They missed an edit from (1:30) to (1:36). That section of music should be edited out. Also, the 45 version fades four seconds sooner than the version on that disc.
Doug, if you check your copies on AM Heavy Hits and Flashback, and then compare that to the remixed version on Best Of, you'll notice the difference as soon as the first verse starts. There's tons more reverb on the vocals on Best Of.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
sriv94
MusicFan
Joined: 16 September 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1457
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 9:13pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
So, if I understand you right, the 45 should run roughly (3:28)? (There are three 45s available on eBay with accompanying photo, but I can't read the running time.)
Good job, Aaron!
__________________
Doug
---------------
All of the good signatures have been taken.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
aaronk
Admin Group
Joined: 16 January 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6513
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 9:18pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
That's exactly right, Doug. Played back on Ed's turntable, the song runs just a hair short of (3:28).
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
sriv94
MusicFan
Joined: 16 September 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1457
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 9:23pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Thanks for the update. And thanks for the E-mail clarification on the fade. :)
__________________
Doug
---------------
All of the good signatures have been taken.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
aaronk
Admin Group
Joined: 16 January 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6513
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 9:23pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Glad I could help!
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Todd Ireland
MusicFan
Joined: 16 October 2004
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4219
|
| Posted: 02 December 2005 at 10:55pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
Back around 1988, I purchased my first copy of the Kansas Best of CD. When I replaced it about five years ago with the remastered version, I could swear "Carry on Wayward Son" sounded like a different mix compared to the version on my previous Best of copy. I'm glad to now know I wasn't imagining things!
So, if I understand correctly, the version of "Wayward Son" on the remastered Best of disc (Epic Associated/Legacy 65690) is the LP mix that originally appeared on vinyl LP copies?
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
aaronk
Admin Group
Joined: 16 January 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 6513
|
| Posted: 03 December 2005 at 11:49am | IP Logged
|
|
|
That's what I gather, Todd. The one on the original version of that disc has a bunch of reverb added to the vocals, removes the vocal delay, and mixes the instruments differently.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
edtop40
MusicFan
Joined: 29 October 2004
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4996
|
| Posted: 08 July 2008 at 5:06pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
my commercial 45 issued as kirshner 4267 states a run time on the label as 3:26 but actually runs 3:27 and after the edit aaron did using the below original cd that i provided him, which btw was the original pressing of the cd and NOT the remastered version.....the 45 and his edit are identical.......and btw......where are the points of the song where the remix is most pronounced?
(S) (5:22) CBS Associated 39283 Best Of (remixed LP version)
is this the only place that the correct remix is located???
Edited by edtop40 on 08 July 2008 at 5:08pm
__________________
edtop40
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Todd Ireland
MusicFan
Joined: 16 October 2004
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4219
|
| Posted: 08 July 2008 at 5:21pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
VERY interesting discovery, Ed. Does this mean then that the CDs listed in the database as being the 45 version really aren't? Or are there perhaps two different 45 pressings... one containing an edit of the LP mix and the other an edit of the LP remix?
I hope I'm not about to regret having gotten rid of my original Kansas Best of CD pressing with the remixed LP version!
Edited by Todd Ireland on 08 July 2008 at 5:23pm
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
sriv94
MusicFan
Joined: 16 September 2005
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1457
|
| Posted: 08 July 2008 at 7:02pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
The 45 isn't available on CD--Aaron made a custom edit to match the 45. Only two of the CDs don't have the LP version (in either the original mix or the remix), and they're both the same CD (the separate The Train Kept A Rollin' set and the full Soundtrack For A Century box set).
Edited by sriv94 on 08 July 2008 at 7:02pm
__________________
Doug
---------------
All of the good signatures have been taken.
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
edtop40
MusicFan
Joined: 29 October 2004
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4996
|
| Posted: 08 July 2008 at 7:55pm | IP Logged
|
|
|
doug is right...the original pressing of the BEST OF cd contains the proper remix version which CAN be edit down to match the 45.....
__________________
edtop40
|
| Back to Top |
|
| |
Active Topics 
Memberlist 
Search 
Help
Register 
Login
Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: "Carry On Wayward Son" -- Kansas
