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jimct
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| Posted: 14 May 2010 at 11:56am | IP Logged
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My commercial 45 (confirmed as King 6035, is vinyl, with deadwax of "101-A (-7) K12097") has a listed time of (2:52) and an actual time of (2:53). I only post this info because every current decent-quality database CD that includes the original recording of this song runs either (2:45) or (2:46), including the normally-quite-reliable, Hip-O Select Singles series! It has been previously discussed that Brown would, more than any other artist, re-mix/re-release a 2nd 45 version of his current hits, with either "less of this" or "more of that". Perhaps the version of this song on my 45 is either, 1) such a second mix, which has eluded all previous CD compilers/researchers or, 2) just another case where a different tape was wrongly thought to be the correct hit 45 master. Anybody else with an original King 6035 45 out there?
Edited by jimct on 15 May 2010 at 10:10pm
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Gary Mack
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| Posted: 15 May 2010 at 6:51am | IP Logged
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Mine sayeth 2:52, it runs 2:53 and reads "101-A (-2) K-12097 LH X-4603".
GM
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Todd Ireland
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| Posted: 15 May 2010 at 9:08am | IP Logged
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Thanks for the info on this, Jim and Gary. I'm also wondering if perhaps the time discrepency between your 45 and the commercial CD appearances could at least partially be explained by a pitch difference?
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Gary Mack
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| Posted: 15 May 2010 at 6:39pm | IP Logged
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Todd Ireland wrote:
| Thanks for the info on this, Jim and Gary. I'm also wondering if perhaps the time discrepency between your 45 and the commercial CD appearances could at least partially be explained by a pitch difference? |
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My Technics turntable has a strobe pitch control and I'm always careful to set it properly.
GM
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Yah Shure
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| Posted: 15 May 2010 at 9:23pm | IP Logged
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Gary, I think Todd meant the differences in mastering speeds (as opposed to "pitch") between the 45 and CD, not your turntable's speed.
I have two copies of the commercial 45, but they differ in appearance. The labels are the same, but although King had its own onsite manufacturing facilities, one copy (#1) has a higher quality vinyl content than the other (#2) which has King's more typically hissy cheap plastic. #1 also has a raised lip around the record's edge on both sides, while the edges on #2 are flat.
Copy #1's deadwax info is almost identical to Jim's copy: "101-A (-7) K-12097". The difference is the hyphen in that last number.
Copy #2's deadwax is closer to Gary's copy, but differs: "101-A (-2) K-12097 LH". There's no "X-4603" (or anything else) following the "LH".
Both #1 and #2 are (2:52) listed and (2:54) actual. To be even more precise, copy 1 runs (2:54.315) and #2 runs (2:54.319). It doesn't get much closer than that.
Edited by Yah Shure on 15 May 2010 at 9:24pm
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Todd Ireland
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| Posted: 15 May 2010 at 9:43pm | IP Logged
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Yah Shure wrote:
| Gary, I think Todd meant the differences in mastering speeds (as opposed to "pitch") between the 45 and CD, not your turntable's speed. |
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Yes, that's what I meant.
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jimct
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| Posted: 15 May 2010 at 10:20pm | IP Logged
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Yah Shure wrote:
| Both #1 and #2 are (2:52) listed and (2:54) actual. To be even more precise, copy 1 runs (2:54.315) and #2 runs (2:54.319). It doesn't get much closer than that. |
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Thanks for your bonus, detailed electronic analysis to turn up that extra second of run time, John. It was obviously undetectable to both Gary's and my human ears! Well, with a total of 4 1966 stock copies being timed, I guess we can now conclude that this longer 45 time is, in fact, the "definitive" 45 time, and is not accurately reflected on any domestic CD. Thanks for going to the extra effort/bother for the cause, gentlemen!
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Robert
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| Posted: 16 May 2010 at 9:13am | IP Logged
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Mine also has a raised lip but deadwax # 101-A (-5) K-12097.
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edtop40
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| Posted: 07 January 2013 at 5:32pm | IP Logged
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this is very odd fellows!!....my commercial 45 for the
james brown song 'it's a man's man's man's world' issued as
king 6035 states the run time on the label as 2:52 but
actually runs 2:46 and matches my cdr version
perfectly....the run out groove info is '101-A (-4) K-
12097'.....if anyone wants a copy for their review send me
a pm and i will forward them a copy...
Edited by edtop40 on 07 January 2013 at 5:33pm
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edtop40
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MMathews
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| Posted: 12 March 2017 at 3:14pm | IP Logged
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Ah just remembered to update this thread... I can answer
the ages old question about the times for this song: the
only difference between the (2:46) singles and the (2:53)
- (2:54) singles is the pitch. So just slow down any of
the CD sources and you got it.
The pitch change is drastic, almost a full semi-tone.
I can add that once I heard it this way, the slower speed
sounds like the actual recording speed and the faster
speed sounds unnatural.
MM
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: James Brown-"It’s A Man’s Man’s Man’s..."
