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| Posted: 15 July 2005 at 5:31am | IP Logged
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Todd, no the two versions of "Whatta Man" listed in my book are not identical although very similar. Starting at 4:16 there is one line on the LP version (that's the 5:07) version that goes "Tell me like that sugar" while the same line on the (4:53) version (whatever version that is), goes "Well what a good man". Any help out there in identifying where this (4:53) version comes from or is it a case of "neither the 45 or LP version"?
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Todd Ireland
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| Posted: 18 July 2005 at 1:09am | IP Logged
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Seal - Don't Cry ==> Single version - 4:30. Album version - 6:17. (available on vinyl 45)
Commercial single copies feature the "Radio Edit".
Seal - Fly Like an Eagle ==> Single - 3:38*. Album - 4:13. (Whitburn - 3:38)
Commercial single copies are reported to state "Radio Edit".
Jon Secada - Do You Believe in Us ==> Single length - 3:40. Album length - 3:58. (available on vinyl 45)
Ed informs me his commercial single copy states "hit version", but it is actually just an early fade of the song's 3:58 album counterpart.
Jon Secada - Angel ==> Single version - 4:09. Album version - 4:34. (available on vinyl 45)
The "Radio Edit" appears on commercial single copies.
Seduction - Two to Make It Right ==> Single version - 4:16. Album version - 4:41. (available on vinyl 45)
The single version is the '7" Remix'. This information comes to you once again courtesy of Edtop40.
Seduction - Heartbeat ==> Album - 7:02. (Whitburn - 4:54) (available on vinyl 45)
Seduction - Could This Be Love ==> Single version - 4:36. Album version - 6:19.
Commercial cassette single copies feature "Radio Edit 1" as the A-side/leadoff track. This is the version I always heard played on radio. The commercial single's B-side "Radio Edit 2" is an edit of the "Quiet Storm Mix" found on Seduction's CD Nothing Matters Without Love (Vendetta/A&M 5280) and has approximately the same run time as Radio Edit 1.
Bob Seger & The Silver Bullet Band - Understanding ==> Single length - 3:42. Album length - 3:51. (available on vinyl 45)
Credit yet another one to Ed!
Bob Seger & The Silver Bullet Band - The Real Love ==> Single - 3:43*. Album - 4:38. (available on vinyl 45)
Based on my research, commercial cassette single copies state "Edit".
Shaggy - Boombastic ==> Single - 3:51. Album - 4:06. (available on vinyl 45)
The single version is the "Radio Edit", which appears on several CDs in the 10th edition. Therefore, the "radio edit" comment listed next to these CDs in the book could probably be more accurately stated as: "single version" or "45 version".
Shai - If I Ever Fall in Love ==> Single and album versions - 3:08 and 4:48. (available on vinyl 45)
I thought it might be worth pointing out that the commercial cassette single contains the "Original Radio Edit" (actual run time: 3:08) on the A-side, and "Groove's Bedroom Mix" (4:48) on the B-side. Both of these versions received significant airplay on my local Top 40 radio stations and both appear on Shai's CD ...If I Ever Fall in Love (Gasoline Alley 10762). On that CD, the single versions are shown as "remix" and "a capella version" on the CD tray insert.
Shai - Baby I'm Yours ==> Single version - 3:53. Album version - 4:33. (available on vinyl 45)
On a side note, I've now gone through 80% of the 10th edition uncovering as many late '80s/early '90s single/album version distinctions as I can find that aren't specifically accounted for in the book. For anyone wondering how much more I'll be adding to this message thread, I'd say I have between six to eight more posts worth of entries before I'll have finished combing through Pat's book cover to cover. After that point, I'll continue to post updates as they arise.
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aaronk
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| Posted: 18 July 2005 at 1:35am | IP Logged
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In regards to Shaggy - Boombastic, the only commercial copy I have seen of this single is the CD-maxi, containing both "In The Summertime" and "Boombastic." On my copy, there are four versions of "In The Summertime" (on tracks 1 thru 4), and the "LP Version" and "Sting Remix" of "Boombastic" on tracks 5 and 6 respectively.
I'm guessing there were other formats (perhaps a 2-track cd or cassette single), so which is the "45 version"? The hit version that radio stations played was the "Sting Remix" which contained the sample of Marvin Gaye's "Let's Get It On." (I've never actually heard the LP Version on the radio, although some stations might have used this mix. The LP Version had the same vocal track, but the music was drastically different.)
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aaronk
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| Posted: 18 July 2005 at 1:35am | IP Logged
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By the way, Todd, your hard work on this massive thread is greatly appreciated!
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Brian W.
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| Posted: 18 July 2005 at 11:38am | IP Logged
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Very much so, Todd.
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davidclark
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| Posted: 18 July 2005 at 2:12pm | IP Logged
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me too! I've taken much in from this thread, as I too track the different versions of songs, and I am not as familiar with (nor do I collect as many of) the more recent songs. thanks everyone.
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Todd Ireland
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| Posted: 22 July 2005 at 1:28pm | IP Logged
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Thanks for the positive feedback everyone! I'm back with some single/album run time confirmations to pass along:
Babyface - And Our Feelings ==> Single version - 4:03. Album version - 5:39.
Divine - One More Try ==> Single version - 4:09. Album version - 5:02.
This is an update of an update. Thanks to some help from Pat, I've determined the single and album are different versions.
Kang Gang - Motortown ==> Single version - 3:47. Album version - 4:45.
George LaMond - Bad of the Heart ==> Single length - 4:06. Album length - 4:17.
This is in response to Pat's question from a while back. Yes, the commercial single of "Bad of the Heart" is indeed an early fade of the album length.
It doesn't stop here... nosiree! Let's bring on the next 12 entries:
Shamen - Move Any Mountain (Progen 91) ==> Single version - 3:24. Album version - 3:25.
The single version is also known as the "Beat Edit". Based on the contents of the commercial cassingle sleeve, the single version is a different mix than the album version although both have almost the same run time. I don't have a copy of the album version with which to do a direct comparison with the single.
Silk - If You (Lovin' Me) ==> Album - 5:37. (Whitburn - 4:10)
According to my sources, CD single copies feature the "Radio Edit" as the leadoff track with a printed run time of 3:54. This contrasts sharply though with Whitburn's listed single time of 4:10.
Simply Red - The Right Thing ==> Single version - 4:14. Album version - 4:18. (available on vinyl 45)
Ed was kind enough to e-mail me an mp3 of his 45. I agree with his observation that the commercial single is a slightly different mix than the album version. The brass instrument (I think it's either an alto or an electronic saxaphone) and the keyboards are mixed hotter on the single, while Mick Hucknall's lead vocal is mixed more up front on the LP version. Pitch-wise, the 45 also runs about four seconds faster than the album version, which accounts for the time difference between the two.
Siouxsie & the Banshees - Kiss Them for Me ==> Single version - 4:27. Album version - 4:35.
At first, I thought the single was an early fade of the album length. But in actuality, the single and album versions are identical only up until the 4:13 mark. At that point, several more "kiss them for me" verses are edited into the single version during the remainder of the fadeout, whereas the album version contains only instrumentation during the fadeout.
69 Boyz - Woof Woof ==> Single and soundtrack version - 4:11 and 4:09, respectively. Album version - 4:31.
The soundtrack CD Dr. Doolittle (Atlantic 83113) was released about one month sooner than the 69 Boyz's The Wait Is Over (Atlantic/Big Beat 83031) disc so I don't know if that has any bearing on which should be considered the official album version. Thanks to Ed for confirming the commercial single run time.
Will Smith - Just the Two of Us ==> Single version - 4:16. Album version - 5:15. (Whitburn - 4:10)
Commercial single copies feature the "Radio Edit" as the leadoff track. Credit goes out to Ed once again for this info.
Smithereens - A Girl Like You ==> Single version - 4:07. Album version - 4:41. (available on vinyl 45)
Smithereens - Too Much Passion ==> Single version - 3:54. Album version - 4:34.
Retail single copies state "Edit".
Patty Smyth - No Mistakes ==> Single length - 4:33. Album length - 5:22. (available on vinyl 45)
Props again to the Guru for providing the inside scoop!
Snoop Doggy Dogg - Gin & Juice ==> Album - 3:31. (Whitburn - 3:41)
Snoop Dogg - Still a G Thang ==> Album - 4:20. (Whitburn - 3:57)
CD single copies are reported to feature the "Radio Version" as the leadoff track.
Sole featuring J.T. Money and Kandi - 4,5,6 ==> Album - 4:15. (Whitburn - 3:40)
CD single copies feature the "Radio Edit" as the leadoff track with a printed run time of 3:17. This contrasts sharply though with Whitburn's listed single time of 3:40.
Edited by Todd Ireland on 22 July 2005 at 1:29pm
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| Posted: 26 July 2005 at 4:30pm | IP Logged
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Somethin' for the People featuring Trina & Tamara - My Love Is the Shhh! ==> Single - 5:06. Album - 4:31.
Curiously, my commercial cassette single copy states "Album Version" even though it runs significantly longer than the actual album time on Somethin' for the People's This Time It's Personal (Warner Brothers 46753) CD. I don't have the latter CD, so I don't know if the single and album is a difference of "version" or just "length".
The S.O.U.L. S.Y.S.T.E.M. - It's Gonna Be a Lovely Day ==> Album - 4:49. (Whitburn - 4:30)
According to my research, the retail cassette single features the "Pop Radio Mix" on the A-side with a printed run time of 4:28, and the "Radio Mix" on the B-side with a printed time of 4:29. This looks like a case where both versions may have received airplay depending on a radio station's particular format.
Soul II Soul - Back to Life (However Do You Want Me) ==> Single version - 3:29. Album version - 3:46.
Edtop40 reports that his commercial single copy contains the "a capella intro" version. This is the version I've always heard on the radio, but I don't think it's ever appeared on a domestic CD release.
The Soup Dragons - Divine Thing ==> Single - 3:33. Album - 3:50. (available on vinyl 45)
Tracie Spencer - This House ==> Album - 5:05. (Whitburn - 4:53)
My research indicates cassette single copies contain both the "LP Version" and the "Radio Edit".
Spice Girls - Too Much ==> Single - 3:50*. Album - 4:31. (Whitburn - 3:49)
Commercial single copies appear to contain the "Radio Edit".
Bruce Springsteen - Streets of Philadelphia ==> Single length - 3:49. Album length - 4:13. (available on vinyl 45)
Stacey Q - We Connect ==> Album - 4:13. (Whitburn - 3:42) (available on vinyl 45)
Commercial vinyl 45 copies are reported to state "Radio Dance Edit" on the label.
Lisa Stansfield - All Around the World ==> Single length - 4:19. Album length - 4:26. (available on vinyl 45)
Lisa Stansfield - This Is the Right Time ==> Single length - 4:12. Album length - 4:29. (available on vinyl 45)
Credit and thanks to Ed for reporting the run times for the above two Lisa Stansfield singles.
Starship - It's Not Over ('Til It's Over) ==> Album - 4:16. (Whitburn - 4:32) (available on vinyl 45)
Starship - It's Not Enough ==> Single version - 4:24. Album version - 4:49. (available on vinyl 45)
The commercial single features the "remix" also found on promo single copies.
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aaronk
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| Posted: 26 July 2005 at 5:45pm | IP Logged
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Todd Ireland wrote:
Soul II Soul - Back to Life (However Do You Want Me) ==> Single version - 3:29. Album version - 3:46.
Edtop40 reports that his commercial single copy contains the "a capella intro" version. This is the version I've always heard on the radio, but I don't think it's ever appeared on a domestic CD release.
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Actually, I've never heard the "a capella intro" version on the radio. I've always heard the album version. To clarify, the album version also has an acapella intro. The difference is that the album version starts off with the line "Back to life, back to reality" repeated twice acapella, and then the drums kick in.
(THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION HAS BEEN UPDATED/CORRECTED TWO POSTS BELOW.)
The "a capella intro" version actually has a whole verse that's not even part of the album version, and the whole first minute or so of the song is acapella. This version starts off with some "oohing" and the lyrics "Steady, are you ready."
You are correct, however, that this version has never been commercially available on a domestic cd. So this is the version the top 40 station in your market played, Todd?
Edited by aaronk on 26 July 2005 at 6:20pm
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I just looked up the track info for Soul II Soul's Club Classics, Vol. 1 - 10th Anniversary Edition, which is available domestically. It has "Back To Life (Acapella)," and listening to the song snippet, this is the way the "a capella intro" version starts. Since I can only hear 30 seconds of the song, I can't say if this is the same one Ed and Todd are referring to, or if this is a different edit/mix, but it sounds like it could be the 45 version.
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aaronk
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| Posted: 26 July 2005 at 6:16pm | IP Logged
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OK, I believe there are actually three versions of "Back To Life" all running right around 3 1/2 minutes. I have to correct the info that I posted above...
The version I was calling "a capella intro" is actually the "acapella" version on Club Classics, Vol. 1 - 10th Anniversary Edition. After downloading the tracks on this CD and pulling out my 12" single, here's a new summary:
1. LP Version - starts with "Back to life, back to reality" repeated twice acapella, and then the drums kick in. Run time is (3:48). This is available on Club Classics, Vol. 1 - 10th Anniversary Edition and Keep On Movin'. (I'm only calling this "LP Version" because it's the one on Keep On Movin'.)
2. A Capella Intro Version - starts with "Back to life, back to reality" repeated twice acapella; then there's a drum beat and "however do you want me, however do you need me" repeated several times acapella; then the drums kick in. Apparently, this is the version that's not available on CD. It is on Ed's cassette single and my 12" record, running (3:29). Is this on the 45, too?
3. Acapella - starts with the "ooohing" and "steady are you ready lyrics." The first couple minutes of the song are all acapella and have additional lyrics that aren't in the album version. The entire song is not acapella, as the drums kick in about half way through. It's a different drum track than what's on the above two versions. Stranglely, this version is labeled "LP Version" on my 12" single. Is this a case where they mislabled or was this the original album version that was later replaced? (Come to think of it, I do recall hearing this on one of the original pressings of the cassette tape.) Run time is (3:39) on the Club Classics, Vol. 1 - 10th Anniversary Edition CD, but it ends abruptly. I'm assuming it segues into the next track, but I only downloaded that song. The full version is on my 12" single, which fades out and runs (3:50).
Edited by aaronk on 26 July 2005 at 6:42pm
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Here's some info on the promo CD single for "Back To Life" (PRCD-2844).
Tracks & printed run times:
1. Acapella Intro Version (3:29)
2. 7" Version (3:48)
3. Club Mix (7:37)
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| Posted: 26 July 2005 at 7:23pm | IP Logged
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I have a couple of questions regarding Todd's latest post of single vs LP versions.
1) Soup Dragons "Divine Thing" - there is no mention of single version or single length. Any clarification?
2) Bruce Springsteen "Streets Of Philadelphia" - there is a 3:14 edit showing up on several cd's such as "The Essential" - is this an official radio edit?
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aaronk
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Pat, back on page 5 of this thread, Todd stated that he was going to not use "version" or "length" if he could not verify the differences between album and single versions. I'm guessing that in the case of Soup Dragons, he does not have one or the other to check if it's an early fade, edit, or different mix used for the single.
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Todd Ireland
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| Posted: 27 July 2005 at 12:18pm | IP Logged
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To Aaron:
The version of Soul II Soul's "Back to Life" I recall hearing on Top 40 radio was definitely the "Acapella Version Intro" version evidently found on commercial single copies. I was living in Wiesbaden, Germany at the time (I'm a military brat and my family was stationed overseas), so this was the version I heard on Armed Forces radio and on the American Top 40 syndicated countdown show. Thanks for clearing up the different versions of "Back to Life" as they are somewhat easy to confuse with one another.
To Pat:
Aaron's response to your inquiry regarding the Soup Dragons' "Divine Thing" single is exactly correct. I used to automatically list "version" by default until I saw it was causing some confusion.
If you'd like to send me an mp3 of the album/LP version of "Divine Thing", I'd be happy to compare it to the single and let you know if there's a difference of length or version.
As for the short 3:14 edit of Bruce Springsteen's "Streets of Philadelphia", I too once thought it might be a radio edit except I have never run across it on a promo DJ copy. In fact, the only promo copy I've seen is a one track CD with a printed run time of 3:51 on Columbia CSK 5664. As far as I can tell, the 3:14 edit first surfaced on Springsteen's Greatest Hits CD (Columbia 67060).
Edited by Todd Ireland on 27 July 2005 at 12:45pm
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Steve Carras
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Taking this into the 60s-70s department.
I mentioned some ijn a DJ edits thread (see top of the board).
(And a Steely Dan and couple of Doors oine.)_
Some I haven't mentioned:
SUITE JUDY BKLUE EYES (October 1969) Crosby Still Nash-the seconverse/Second Chrosu, third verse, and the reptition of the choruses ("You make it ahrd"), in the first movement is deleted, then the third/fourth verses in the second ("I'm gonna fly","Will ya come see me),is exised too, then the instrumental break and final verse (the triple alliterative "Lacy Lilting Leering" lyric 9that's quadruple!) ) in the final is gone but the finale with the Spanish words is intact.
Doors RIDERS ON THE STORM(July 1971)-the opening is shortened, and three parts in the cool jazz second part to the song taken out as were after the slowdonw, two of the riffs before the next chrosu taken out, then the chorus, then another instrumental then half the final chorus with the title, then a few barsa removed and possibly some storm SFX removed.This was the last Doors hit.(The first, LIGHT MY FIRE had famously been edited from 7 minutes like RotS to just 3 minutes since that was earlier, with a four minute edit and a few bits taken out,Any of theeissues just with the long seciton on LmF removed is the reissues.)
SUNSHINE SUPERMAN Donovan. (July 66).The second verse, which to quote Hoiman's Hopimits is same as the (post-break) last),removed but the second occurence, as what is the final verse, of this "Superman" reference, is there on botrh single and album.Also the guitar solo (by Jimmy Page..) and ending are shortnened too.
Here's two from Dylan and from 1966,both from BLONDE ON BLONDE and Columbia.
RAINY DAY WOMEE (the song everybody knows as everybody must git stoned). The section consisting of a third verse and the first instrumental break is gone from the speeded up 45, as were the second instrumental break, which is where you'll here the Columbia 45 fade (April,1966), and the final verse, and ensuing final passage,are deleted.
JUST LIKE A WOMAN (1966). On BLONDE ON BLONDE, there is a additional verse/chrous that is not at all heard on single,nor is the longer ending.The 45 rom,btw has a real avant garade sound going verse/chorus/bridge/verse/.chorus
(!!!!!!!!!)
Steppenwolf';s MAGIC CARPET RIDE (Dunhill,October 12,1968) #1, is wehere we get into the remxied/different takes,which vocally is all the first verse to this really is plus the longer open and instrumental portion.Some claim that the entire record on 45 is a different recording too.
Some "where did allo this extra verbal stuff come from" stuff from the 70s
YOU"RE STILL A YOUNG MAN (1972) by Tower of Power. Two parts of the brassy intro are taken out,like wise the second half of the first verse then chorus and first half of second verse (cf.the aforemntioned Dylkan RAINY DAY WOMEN) are gone then on (bo0th 45 and album) to the bridge but half removed. The same on both Lp and single till the 2 minute recitiaiton on LP (BUMP CITY and all of the gretaets hits) and the much shroter WB single.
SUAVECITO (1972) by Malo. The open and ending are shortned, similair to Tower of Power & Dylan's first song mentiooned above), part of the first verse,going to the second, remvoed, then weird editding around the chorous and totally taking the "All I want is you, if I can;t have you I wouldn't knwo what to do." Then halved is the 2x "I never met a girl like you in my life (originally used,in full on both LP and 45, in the first verse,replacede in second by "From the day I ffirst fell for you"). As said before faded early.
FOOLED AROUND & FELL IN LOVE (1976) by Elvin Bishop (vocal:Mickey Thomas) The intro's shrotened in afew places,liekwise the first verse/second verse are remvoed the on to the shrotened chrous and edning.
MIRACLES (1975) by Jefferson Starship. Shortened on single, it has twice as long into, the chorus @x AT A TIME! and severla verse at a time, like a longer verrison of a KC SUNSHIEN BAND or George McCRaew or O;'Jays song complete with final instrumentla part,ironcially this isn;'t any longer on LP then on singlke, but the song continued going on and on , on the Lp vis a vis the much faded shorter ending on single! (When edited it's like the other songs in the paragraph doevoted to this song in structure.)
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| Posted: 30 July 2005 at 5:32am | IP Logged
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Regarding the Soup Dragons "The Divine Thing", the 45 which runs (3:33) is just an early fade of the LP so it should be properly addressed as 45 length.
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Todd Ireland
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| Posted: 31 July 2005 at 10:31pm | IP Logged
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Thanks, Pat.
I have an update regarding a couple of my most recent entries. I consulted Pat on these and we came to the following conclusions...
Somethin' for the People featuring Trina & Tamara - My Love Is the Shhh! ==> Single and album version -5:06.
I listened to an mp3 Pat made me of the song as it appears on the This Time It's Personal CD. It turns out "My Love Is the Shhh!" actually runs 5:06 on this disc and is identical to the version on the commercial single. Therefore, the 4:31 run time listed in the 10th edition is in error and will be corrected to read 5:06.
Shamen - Move Any Mountain (Progen 91)
Pat and I swapped mp3s so we could both do a direct comparison of the commercial single and album versions. We both agree the versions sound the same and therefore no single/album distinction is necessary here.
Ok, well I have 12 more for y'all...
Stevie B - I'll Be by Your Side ==> Single version - 4:16. Album version - 4:58. (available on vinyl 45)
The single and album version are identical up until about the 4:00 mark before an edit occurs on the single. By the way, the song title has a typographical error in the 10th edition... It currently reads "I'LL BE BY YOU SIDE".
Stevie B - Funky Melody ==> Album - 4:53. (Whitburn - 3:53) (available on vinyl 45)
I have this song on my Promo Only: Mainstream Radio promo CD subscription series and it runs 4:53 just like on the album. Does anyone know if the commercial single contains a shortened version/length, or is the 3:53 run time Whitburn lists in Top Pop Annual a typo?
Rod Stewart - Downtown Train ==> Single length - 4:30. Album length - 4:39. (available on vinyl 45)
The info on these next three Rod Stewart singles come courtesy of Edtop40. Commercial and promo single copies of "Downtown Train" state "Fade" on the label.
Rod Stewart - Rhythm of My Heart ==> Single version - 3:52. Album version - 4:12. (available on vinyl 45)
The first :20 of the LP intro is edited out on the commercial single version.
Rod Stewart (with Ronnie Wood) - Reason to Believe ==> Single version - 3:51. Album version - 4:07. (available on vinyl 45)
Cassette single copies state "album version", but the single eliminates the spoken intro found on the album version.
Rod Stewart - Ooh La La ==> Single version - 4:01*. Album version - 4:14. (Whitburn - 3:58) (available on vinyl 45)
Sting - Love Is the Seventh Wave ==> Single version - 3:45. Album version - 3:28. (available on vinyl 45)
Ed reports the commercial 45 sleeve and label states "Special Single Version" and is indeed a completely different mix than the LP version.
Sting - When We Dance ==> Single version - 4:55*. Album version - 5:57. (Whitburn - 4:50) (available on vinyl 45)
Commercial single copies all state "edit" on the label.
Suave - My Girl ==> Single version - 3:53. Album version - 5:36. (available on vinyl 45)
Sunscream - Love U More ==> Album - 4:11. (Whitburn - 3:58)
Surface - Never Gonna Let You Down ==> Single - 3:47. Album - 4:01. (available on vinyl 45)
The single version/length appears on the CD Best of Surface...A Nice Time 4 Lovin' (Columbia 48649). I don't have the album rendition running 4:01, so I don't know if the single is an edit or an early fade of the album. Pat should be able to compare the two and determine if the difference is "version" or "length". Also, thanks to Ed for confiming the commercial single run time.
Keith Sweat - Make You Sweat ==> Album - 5:18. (Whitburn - 3:38) (available on vinyl 45)
I'm currently trying to find out if the 3:49 version on the CD Best of - Make You Sweat (Elektra/Rhino 73954) is the single version.
Edited by Todd Ireland on 31 July 2005 at 10:35pm
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aaronk
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| Posted: 01 August 2005 at 1:22am | IP Logged
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That's interesting about "Love Is The Seventh Wave." I have a UK import 12" single that has "New Mix" listed as the version. This mix runs (4:05) and it is also different than the album version. I wonder if the "Special Single Version" is an edit of the "New Mix."
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| Posted: 02 August 2005 at 6:13am | IP Logged
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Regarding "Never Gonna Let You Down" by Surface, the 45 is an edit of the LP version.
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Topic: Single/album version distinctions...
