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JL328
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| Posted: 06 March 2013 at 9:20am | IP Logged
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Is there really no thread on this song?
The 45 Version has a :07 spoken introduction. It was a dialog between Davy Jones and somebody concerning which take they were on. There was a short joke thrown in there as well.
I'm trying to figure out the time difference between the original 45/LP Version and the CD Versions.
According to the database, the 45/LP Version ran about 2:56 with the :07 introduction.
The CD Versions run about 2:56 without the introduction and run about 3:05 with the introduction.
So, does anybody know what the time difference is? Was the CD version without the introduction slowed down to match the 2:56 run time of the original 45/LP version with the introduction?
I realize that this question can easily be answered by comparing the CD Version with the 45 or LP, but I don't own either of the original sources.
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JL328
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| Posted: 07 March 2013 at 5:51am | IP Logged
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I found a video of the 45 on YouTube and I think have answered my own
question....
The 45 (and, I presume the LP as well) fades earlier than the versions
appearing on CD. The CD versions (at least the ones appearing on the
Monkees' Greatest Hits and the Time Life Classic Rock series) go on for about
5 to 6 seconds after the 45 stops.
So, should the CD versions with the :07 introduction have a notation stating
that they contain the 45 (and LP?) version but longer? Or am I missing
something?
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Tim Lyman
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| Posted: 16 March 2013 at 1:01am | IP Logged
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Hi JL. The version of "Daydream Believer" with a longer fade is a remix that was done by Bill Inglot back in the '80s (not to be confused with the version with re-recorded drums, which hasn't appeared on CD.)
Looking at the database, it looks like the early CD appearances of this song used Inglot's remix, while later CDs (from roughly the mid-'90s on) use the original stereo or mono mixes, either with or without the spoken introduction.
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NightAire
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Is the Bill Inglot remix the version that hit the charts (yes, really) in 1986?
My jaw dropped to see it pop up on November 1st, 1986's chart at #90. It spent the next two weeks at #79, then back to #89, and by November 29th it has disappeared.
Does anybody know if #1 there was actually a promo serviced to radio in 1986 and #2 if it was the original mix or the remix that radio stations played at the time?
EDIT: the 1986 label says "additional production and mixing by Michael Lloyd for Mike Curb Productions."
See it here.
Edited by NightAire on 23 November 2015 at 11:56am
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crapfromthepast
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| Posted: 23 November 2015 at 12:16pm | IP Logged
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Gene - From memory...
Arista released the Then And Now 2-LP greatest hits set in 1986, which included a newly-recorded called "That But Then This Is Now" (produced by Michael Lloyd, and originally recorded in 1985 by the Mosquitos). Arista released the new song as a 45, and it did respectably. Arista turned to "Daydream Believer" as a follow-up single, but let Michael Lloyd remix it to fit in with the 1986 bombastic-drum-sound stuff on the charts. Radio largely ignored it.
The 1986 "Daydream Believer" remix that hit the charts was NOT subtle; it was a drastic overhaul that brought the (rerecorded?) drums WAY out in front. You'd know it if you heard it, and you'd scratch your head afterward wondering why it even exists.
The new remix was released on a 45 on Arista, and I think there would have been a promo 45 as well (I can't confirm). I have the track on an Arista promo-only multi-artist LP (can't recall the title offhand).
The Bill Inglot remix is faithful to the original mix, and is extremely tasteful in comparison.
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Bill Cahill
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| Posted: 23 November 2015 at 2:00pm | IP Logged
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Radio was served a promo copy with the updated Michael
Lloyd version.
The Bill Inglot remix turned off the microphone track
during the piano intro and during the instrumental
break. On the original stereo mix you can hear Davy
breathing, clearing his voice, etc. Plus there are some
minor mix differences compared to the original stereo
mix.
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NightAire
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| Posted: 23 November 2015 at 9:57pm | IP Logged
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I'm wondering if it is this mixas the drums sound all kinds of wrong.
A friend an Monkees fan says this remix was on the "Then / Now" LP / CD released that was mentioned by CFTP. The database, however, seems to suggest it had the Inglot mix.
Can anybody confirm if the "Then / Now" version is the Inglot or the Lloyd mix?
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aaronk
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| Posted: 23 November 2015 at 11:22pm | IP Logged
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This one specifically says 1986 remix, and the drums are noticeably
different: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vDSzaJECFxc
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Bill Cahill
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| Posted: 24 November 2015 at 5:05am | IP Logged
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The title track (and only new recording on the CD)
"That Was Then, This is Now" was first issued as "The
Monkees" but later changed to "Mickey Dolenz and Peter
Tork (of the Monkees). I believe this change was made
because Davy complained that Arista didn't have the
right to issue that song as "the Monkees". But the
song did well enough to warrant a follow up. Without
another "new" song on that CD, Arista chose to create
a Michael Lloyd remix of "Daydream Believer" with
updated drums and other instruments, hoping to get
some CHR play (as they did with "That Was Then..") but
apparently it didn't do well enough to warrant re-
issuing the CD with the Michael Lloyd remix. So to
this day, I've only found the Michael Lloyd version on
that 1986 Arista 45.
Edited by Bill Cahill on 24 November 2015 at 5:06am
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jimct
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| Posted: 24 November 2015 at 5:45am | IP Logged
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As to the version on the "Then & Now" CD, both my copy of the CD (which
also features the Inglot mix) and Bill Cahill's post above 100% jives with my
own 1986 recollections. And Gene, since you seem less than 100% sure as to
where the versions you're locating on the 'Net are coming from exactly, I'm
shooting you out both my "Then & Now" CD and 1986 my promo 45 version
for "Daydream Beleiever", to end your guesswork once and for all.
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Glenpwood
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| Posted: 24 November 2015 at 7:45am | IP Logged
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I believe all CD copies of Then And Now have the Inglot
mix. The dreaded drum mix is known to exist on
repressings of the vinyl and cassette. (This did make it
to 8 Track via Columbia House but I'll let the really
obsessed track that down and see whats on it). The
easiest way to track them down is if you run across a
sealed or in shrink copy of the LP, look at the hype
sticker. The Inglot version is on the copies with the MTV
logo highlighting only the three new Monkees songs Micky
& Peter recorded for it. The drum mix version has a hype
sticker highlighting Daydream Believer being on the
album and no MTV logo. Why the CD never got changed I'm
unsure but
whenever this topic comes up in Monkees threads online no
one has yet to come up with a copy.
Edited by Glenpwood on 24 November 2015 at 7:46am
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NightAire
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Thanks again, Jim, for helping me separate fact from speculation; it's clear the video I posted DOES use the '86 remix.
I have a friend, a Monkees fanatic, who swears up and down his CD copy of "Then / Now" has the '86 "big drums" remix on it... I'm trying to get access to his CD so I can determine if there actually could be a CD copy of this mix out there (and I'll get everything I can off the label regarding the pressing, serial number, etc. if it turns out to be true!)or if he's just mis-remembering (which I know is most likely).
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TomDiehl1
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Bill Inglot says they prepared a version
of the album with the drums remix for a
Columbia record club CD release, but does
not know if they ever actually issued it.
Has anybody got the CD as a Columbia House
/ record club issue to report what version
is on there?
Edited by TomDiehl1 on 16 January 2017 at 12:52am
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JL328
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| Posted: 11 March 2017 at 5:27am | IP Logged
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Never noticed this before but the Rhino digital 45 of "Daydream Believer" is
not actually the 45 version, is it? Rhino's got it in stereo.
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Brian W.
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| Posted: 11 March 2017 at 6:30am | IP Logged
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JL328 wrote:
Never noticed this before but the Rhino
digital 45 of "Daydream Believer" is
not actually the 45 version, is it? Rhino's got it in
stereo. |
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You're right. But its B-side, "I'm Goin' Down," is mono and is the only place to get the B-side in its 45 version. It wasn't on the deluxe editions of the albums issued a few years back.
https://us.7digital.com/artist/the-monkees/release/daydream- believer-goin-down-digital-45-528761?f=20%2C19%2C12%2C16%2C1 7%2C9%2C2
Edited by Brian W. on 11 March 2017 at 6:34am
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vinyljay69
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TomDiehl1 wrote:
Bill Inglot says they prepared a version
of the album with the drums remix for a
Columbia record club CD release, but does
not know if they ever actually issued it.
Has anybody got the CD as a Columbia House
/ record club issue to report what version
is on there? |
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I have a CD version of the CRC edition, but it features the same mix as on the original LP. My reissue LP features the '86 single remix.
Bill Cahill wrote:
The title track (and only new recording on the CD)...But the
song did well enough to warrant a follow up. Without
another "new" song on that CD, Arista chose to create
a Michael Lloyd remix of "Daydream Believer" with
updated drums and other instruments |
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With all due respect to Bill, there were three new recordings on the album - "That Was Then, This Is Now", "Anytime, Anyplace, Anywhere", and a cover of "Kicks". My guess is Arista didn't see hit potential in the latter two.
Brian W. wrote:
| But its B-side, "I'm Goin' Down," is mono and is the only place to get the B-side in its 45 version. It wasn't on the deluxe editions of the albums issued a few years back. |
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The mono single version of "Goin' Down" is now available on "The Monkees 50" compilation from last year.
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PopArchivist
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crapfromthepast wrote:
Gene - From memory...
Arista released the Then And Now 2-LP greatest hits set in 1986, which included a newly-recorded called "That But Then This Is Now" (produced by Michael Lloyd, and originally recorded in 1985 by the Mosquitos). Arista released the new song as a 45, and it did respectably. Arista turned to "Daydream Believer" as a follow-up single, but let Michael Lloyd remix it to fit in with the 1986 bombastic-drum-sound stuff on the charts. Radio largely ignored it.
The 1986 "Daydream Believer" remix that hit the charts was NOT subtle; it was a drastic overhaul that brought the (rerecorded?) drums WAY out in front. You'd know it if you heard it, and you'd scratch your head afterward wondering why it even exists.
The new remix was released on a 45 on Arista, and I think there would have been a promo 45 as well (I can't confirm). I have the track on an Arista promo-only multi-artist LP (can't recall the title offhand).
The Bill Inglot remix is faithful to the original mix, and is extremely tasteful in comparison. |
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Ron,
I take it the 45 released in 1986 never made it to CD, correct? Pat's database makes no differential between the 1986 release and any other release. I would think since it was a big #1 hit that even a remix like that would be included somewhere on CD, no?
https://www.discogs.com/The-Monkees-Daydream-Believer/master /510228
Edited by PopArchivist on 11 October 2020 at 7:56pm
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crapfromthepast
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Rich - I haven't found it on CD at all. I think that all parties involved with this remix would like it to quietly fade into oblivion!
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Paul Haney
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JL328 wrote:
The 45 Version has a :07 spoken
introduction. It was a dialog between Davy Jones and
somebody concerning which take they were on. |
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Just FYI, that "somebody" was producer Chip Douglas.
For those curious about the 1986 remix, here it is:
Daydream
Believer 1986 remix
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thecdguy
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The 1986 Remix of "Daydream Believer" is on the "Classic Album Collection" box set on the Bonus Disc.
The 2018 compilation An Introduction To The Monkees, Vol. 2 has a version of "Goin' Down" labelled as "Single Version", but there's no indication in the
liner notes as to it being mono or stereo. I found the box set at an FYE store and the Vol. 2 compilation at a Barnes & Nobles store.
Edited by thecdguy on 12 October 2020 at 5:46am
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Topic: Daydream Believer- Monkees
