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elcoleccionista
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| Posted: 18 July 2015 at 8:05am | IP Logged
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This one failed to crack the Hot 100 back in 1987. The double A-
sided promo 7" MCA-53194 features a "Shep Pettibone Mix". Do
you know if this remix made an apparition on digital format at all?
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jimct
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| Posted: 22 July 2015 at 7:11pm | IP Logged
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Greetings Johann, old buddy!
According to Discogs, the Shep Pettibone 7" mix of "Never Be The Same"
has a listed time of (3:59). I see no CD availabilty worldwide for this 45v.
But the Shep Pettibone 12" mix of the song has a listed time of (6:49), and
I see 3 various artists CDs that have a version stating a time in the (6:47-9
range.) Some specifically state that it is the Pattibone Mix. They are:
-Universal Music/Rodeo Music (Netherlands) 533 462-1 - "Dance
Classics: Best Of, Vol. 5" (3 CDs; 2011)
-Blanco Y Negro MXCD 1561 CB (Spain) - "I Love Disco 80's Vol. 1" (2
CDs; 2005)
-Rodeo Media RDM090 (Netherlands) - "Dance Classics 29 & 30" (3 CDs;
2010)
All appear to have at least one CD copy currently available on Discogs
Marketplace, with at least one copy at around only $10, plus S&H.
Good luck, and happy hunting.......
Edited by jimct on 22 July 2015 at 7:22pm
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NightAire
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| Posted: 27 March 2021 at 10:41pm | IP Logged
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Did anyone ever check if the 12" could be edited down to match the 7"?
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Gene Savage
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NightAire
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| Posted: 07 April 2021 at 10:30pm | IP Logged
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Thank to Aaron I can now confirm that the 12" CAN be edited down to match the 7".
My particular vinyl dub runs 0.4% faster than the CD track I have... which is negligible and may also be the result of an improperly adjusted turntable speed.
I'm using the 12" version found on "Dance Classics Vol. 30." All of these edits will be on the beat, nothing complicated.
Delete 16 seconds from 0:08 to 0:25.
Delete 24 seconds from 0:16 to 0:41.
Delete 49 seconds from 3:51 to 4:40.
Delete 8 seconds from 4:08 to 4:16.
The fade starts at approximately 4:33 running 13 seconds until 4:46.
I'm dealing again with an incomplete dub, so I don't actually know if the single goes to silence at 4:46 or goes all the way out to 4:50 (the next sung phrase). The music was significantly faded but cut off at 4:42. The label says 4:46. YMMV.
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Owasso, Oklahoma USA
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promojunkie
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| Posted: 27 July 2021 at 3:40pm | IP Logged
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I'm a bit confused with Gene's editing instructions. Is
the 45 version of Shep's mix 3:59 or 4:46? There is a
video version on youtube that clocks in at 3:57 but
after you cut off the first bit of dialogue, it runs
3:52 so I'm not sure about that one. Can anyone list
the edit(s) and fade point to recreate the
promo/commercial 3:59 version? Much appreciated.
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EternalStatic
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| Posted: 28 July 2021 at 6:03am | IP Logged
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Hey guys, I've noted on Discogs this morning that the commercial US single is labeled "The Shep Pettibone Mix" on both sides, but each side
has different listed times. The A-side, which would appear to match the promo 45, is listed 3:59 while the B-side is listed 4:40. This
4:40 (listed) version also pops up on a Japanese promo 45. My guess is that the version used in the video is the "Short" 3:59 version and Gene has
provided useful editing instructions for the "Long" 4:40 edit.
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EternalStatic
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| Posted: 29 August 2021 at 7:09am | IP Logged
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(Updating my original follow-up with fresh instructions, etc.)
Thanks to the link that Mike (mjb50) posted in the thread below, I was able to review the "Short" 45 A-Side Version. As it turns out, yes, it can be successfully re-created from the 12" Version, but my original assumption that the longer
4:44 "Long" edit that Gene posted instructions for above could just undergo a couple of snips to get down to the "Short" version, was incorrect. I'll explain what happened there in the next post if you're interested.
So, in order to create the single version of "Never Be the Same", let's start over again with a fresh copy of Shep's 12" Version. I used the Dance Classics mastering, same as Gene:
1. Delete from 0.00 to 41.512. The right edit point will be just before a downbeat (kickdrum + cymbal) where the keyboards come in.
2. From the resultant file, delete about 16.5 seconds from 0:01.154 to 0:18.052. The edit point should be just a tiny hair to the left of the '4th beat' in either measure, which is a "snare" hit. Putting the edit points just to the
left of the beat will result in the guitar appearing barely before the snare hit, after the edit is performed.
3. From the resultant file, delete about 1:39.094 from 3:16.625 to 4:55.719. Both the left edit point and the right will be on a snare hit concurrent with the word "the" (as in "... the same"). By doing this, you are removing the breakdown
section of the dance mix. After performing the edit, you should have a saxophone rolling into the mix pretty soon after the cut.
4. This next edit is a bit tricky. You would think that with the file whittled down to its current length, you could simply snip the end and fade, but alas... Someone thought it would be a good idea to loop some of the previous chorus in
before fading. So, what you need to do here is:
a. Go to 3:27.981 and copy to the end of your current file. The left edit ("copy") point should be on the snare concurrent with the word "never".
b. Replace from 3:40.370 to the end of your original file with the section you copied in 4a. The edit ("replace") point is again, on a snare concurrent with the word "never".
c. Your new file length should be about 4:25.157. The previous cut+paste in steps 4a-b should have changed the flow of the lyrics from "I will never be the same" to "I will ne-veeeer be... (oh)"
5. Now the "snip & fade". I admit that my fade-end point is just an educated guess, as the Youtube rip that Mike linked to below cuts off at about 3:56 before the fade is fully, fully complete. Based on the rate at which the song is fading
when the video cuts, I believe it is very safe to assume that the 3:59 time printed on the label is pretty spot-on. I actually cut my file at 4:00.139 on the snare after the lyric, "Everything may be the same as it was." The fade starts at
around 3:46.5 and is a typical bell curve, pretty quick on the front end actually.
6. The only thing left to do now, if you're a perfectionist, is futz with the tail on the cymbal that leads into the first beat. I faded mine in just a hair to be less abrupt. YMMV on that point.
I admit this is an embarrassing amount of specificity for a song that I'm sure not a lot of people are that excited about (LOL), but I wanted to share the instructions for the record. Enjoy!
Edited by EternalStatic on 30 August 2021 at 11:02am
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EternalStatic
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| Posted: 29 August 2021 at 7:24am | IP Logged
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P.S. A little more minutae before I forget:
• Be wary of using the music video found on Youtube to recreate the short edit. This got me all turned around in my initial attempt. There is only one version of the video currently posted, and now I realize that it
seems someone has possibly relaid a custom edit on top of the original video. For what purpose I don't know, because the audio is still pretty bad. But the giveaway is toward the end of the video when the lead
singer is ad libbing an "Ohhh" as on the 45 edit and the audio is playing a simple run through of the chorus with no ad libs. This does lead credence to the idea that the original music video does match the 45
"Short Version", but I can't validate that with the info. I have.
• The Dance Classics mastering of the 12" Version is probably the best source that you're going to find to work with. It is quite boomy, and I can't really tell if it's a heavily EQ'ed vinyl rip or if it
is from tape and is just emblematic of Shep's boombox-ish style at the time (think his mixes of "Causing a Commotion", etc.) Through the magic of the internet, I have listened to the version from the I Love
Disco disc, and it is worse. Very dull and almost certainly a lesser quality vinyl rip. I would not waste my time seeking the I Love Disco disc out just for a long mix of this song.
• Through the help of another generous board member, I was able to check out the 4:44 (listed) version of "Never Be the Same" from an early MCA CHR Sampler disc. This is not the 4:44 "Long Version"
discussed throughout the thread, but is likely the "Breakfast Beats" from the 12" Single. It contains about 45 seconds of a capella and then beats for four minutes. Cool to hear, but cannot be used as a
substitute for the "Long" or "Short" 45 versions.
Hope this info helps someone!
Edited by EternalStatic on 30 August 2021 at 10:54am
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eriejwg
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| Posted: 29 August 2021 at 7:53am | IP Logged
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Would love to hear both the short and long edits as I don't
have source material to work with to complete my own edits.
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John Gallagher
John Gallagher Wedding & Special Event Entertainment
Snapblast Photo Booth
Erie, PA
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mjb50
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| Posted: 29 August 2021 at 2:37pm | IP Logged
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The 3:59 version is on YouTube.
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EternalStatic
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| Posted: 29 August 2021 at 3:31pm | IP Logged
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Thanks!!
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EternalStatic
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| Posted: 30 August 2021 at 10:55am | IP Logged
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*Updated the editing notes, if anyone wants to go crazy on this one.
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promojunkie
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| Posted: 10 November 2023 at 9:31am | IP Logged
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FYI for anyone who is interested in this song, I have the
commercial 45 with the 4:45 and 3:59 versions and they can
both be recreated until a certain point - the fade outs.
There is a different sax arrangement layered over the
vocals that is not present on the 12" that I can find.
There are 2 Shep single versions posted on YouTube, one is
probably a custom made edit and the other is the true 45
but cuts off.
Edited by promojunkie on 10 November 2023 at 6:54pm
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Topic: Breakfast Club "Never Be The Same"
