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jimct
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| Posted: 10 December 2007 at 10:28am | IP Logged
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Since database CD listings for the "45 Version" of this song run between (4:24) and (4:34), I decided to time my commercial 45. It states "LP Edit", has a listed time of (4:34) and an actual time of (4:33). My promo 45 also has this exact same version on one side of it. But the other side of my promo 45 has a "Live Version", with a listed time of (4:50) and an actual time of (4:48). My promo CD single (DPRO-04061) also has the exact same two tracks that appear on my promo 45. The database currently states "DJ copies of this 45 ran (4:20) and (4:34)". Pat, perhaps you own a different promo 45 than I do, because I have no evidence of a DJ 45 version that has either a listed or an actual time of (4:20).
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aaronk
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| Posted: 10 December 2007 at 12:30pm | IP Logged
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Jim, I believe the (4:20) version is the AC Edit that Pat is referring to.
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Pat Downey
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| Posted: 10 December 2007 at 5:57pm | IP Logged
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I cannot find a vinyl 45 or cd single in my collection with a stated time of (4:20) so someone must have emailed the information to me. Does anyone out there have this (4:20) dj copy?
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aaronk
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| Posted: 11 December 2007 at 3:22am | IP Logged
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The AC Edit is on promo 45 7PRO-04064 with a listed time of (4:20). It is a slightly remixed version, other than running shorter than the stock 45.
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eriejwg
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| Posted: 11 December 2007 at 4:49am | IP Logged
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There is a version on the Japanese import CD called "Ballads" with a listed time of 4:23. Meaningless, I know, since imports aren't listed in the database.
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aaronk
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| Posted: 11 December 2007 at 11:59pm | IP Logged
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Still, good information about that Ballads CD. It's worth looking into.
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Bellenger1981
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| Posted: 11 October 2024 at 1:22pm | IP Logged
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Note that the 45 version gets a "remixed by David Cole"
credit. Would you all agree that the intro is remixed? If
you listen to the album version, the keyboard overlaps the
bass line where the 45 version starts. The 45 version
starts clean with just the bass and not remnants of the
keyboard. It's not simply just an edit of the album
version. I checked my "Richard Marx" album credits, and it
lists "engineered and mixed by David Cole" for "Hold On to
the Nights". For its single release, I bet David Cole went
back in to remix the intro without the keyboard overlap.
Edited by Bellenger1981 on 11 October 2024 at 1:41pm
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crapfromthepast
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| Posted: 13 October 2024 at 8:34pm | IP Logged
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I did a null test of the 45 version vs. the LP version. There's an edit at 10.4 seconds into the 45 (excluding the intro silence), after which the 45 matches the LP (with an EQ difference).
I'd bet that the first 10.4 seconds of the 45 are remixed (compared to the LP), but that's about it.
Also, the "AC Edit" isn't just a slight remix; the "AC Edit" actually omits the big drums that come in after the solo. I heard this version quite a bit on the radio back then, and it confused me because the LP and 45 both have the big drums.
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Bellenger1981
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| Posted: 14 October 2024 at 2:34pm | IP Logged
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Thank you for your analysis on this one, Ron!
I used to hear the "AC Edit" quite a bit on the radio. The
"AC Edit" outro, which is cut and pasted from the 45/LP
version outro, has always bothered me. It just seems a bit
off and sloppy.
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Jason Bellenger
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aaronk
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| Posted: 15 October 2024 at 6:43pm | IP Logged
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Actually, that outro is uniquely mixed and is not simply spliced on from the original version. If you listed to the 45 version ending, you'll hear an additional synthesizer that is missing from the AC Edit's ending. I agree that the edit is clunky, though.
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Aaron Kannowski
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Bellenger1981
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| Posted: 16 October 2024 at 6:48pm | IP Logged
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Never noticed that, Aaron. Thanks for the
clarification.
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Jason Bellenger
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aaronk
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| Posted: 20 October 2024 at 9:18pm | IP Logged
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I went ahead and ordered the Japanese Ballads CD, and it does include the AC Edit of "Hold On To The Nights." Unfortunately, it sounds like an improperly decoded Dolby transfer. It's not necessarily bad sounding, but the Dolby issue makes it sound like a high generation tape and really exaggerates the highs compared with the 45.
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AndrewChouffi
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| Posted: 22 October 2024 at 4:19am | IP Logged
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Aaron graciously let me hear the cut on the 'Ballads' CD;
yep, the dreaded undecoded Dolby rears its ugly head
again...
However, he also let me listen to a pristine dub of the AC
edit.
Was it ever issued promotionally on CD (such as Hitmakers)
or did Aaron meticulously edit in the unique audio from
the promo 45 donut??
Andy
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aaronk
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| Posted: 22 October 2024 at 6:19am | IP Logged
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Hey Andy,
I sent you a PM yesterday, but I'll answer your question here. The short answer is 'yes,' but I had to go back and de-construct my re-construction to figure out where it all came from. In my PM, I let you know I sent you my cleaned up promo 45, which is not totally accurate.
The main part of the song from 0:00 to 3:16 is identical between the AC Edit and 45 version. From that point forward, the mixes differ.
TM Century issued the AC Edit on both a HitDisc and GoldDisc, and to my ears this comes from a tape source. The trouble with TM's copy is that they tended to run all their songs through "No Noise," and I could hear the NR on their copy during the quieter passages, especially the ending.
For my re-construction, I used the normal 45 version from CD, TM's version from 3:16 to 3:50 (the loudest passage of the song where noise reduction could not be detected), and then my own cleanup from 3:50 to 4:21.
Edited by aaronk on 22 October 2024 at 6:41am
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Aaron Kannowski
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AndrewChouffi
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| Posted: 23 October 2024 at 4:37am | IP Logged
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Thanks for the detailing, Aaron; I did not get a chance to
check the PM yesterday.
It's interesting that you think TM Century's might have
been from a non-vinyl source at that time. In that era TM
typically used US CD promos as their source, but would dub
a 45 or promo 12-inch if no digital was currently
available. Hitmakers was pretty much the only DJ source
that obtained an occasional DAT of a radio mix that wasn't
otherwise promotionally (or commercially) available.
Andy
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aaronk
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| Posted: 23 October 2024 at 8:37am | IP Logged
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Yeah, TM typically didn’t have any special sources that weren’t otherwise
available, so I don’t know if this version showed up on a promo sampler or if
this was a case where they got a DAT or reel copy directly from the label. All
I know is that the 45 is pressed on styrene and both sides of my copy get
distorted during the loud passage (the same passage I mentioned I used
from TM’s disc). Their copy doesn’t have a trace of vinyl noise or distortion
anywhere—just undesirable noise reduction, which isn’t necessarily heavy
but enough that I can hear it in places.
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Aaron Kannowski
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: Richard Marx-"Hold On To The Nights"
