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jimct
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| Posted: 27 February 2009 at 8:32pm | IP Logged
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My commercial 45, confirmed as Atco 6127, has a listed time of (2:08), but an actual time of (2:05). Current database CDs that feature this song have run times ranging from (2:03) to (2:10).
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edtop40
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| Posted: 20 April 2013 at 4:13am | IP Logged
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my commercial 45 issued as atco 6127 lists a run time on
the label as 2:08 but actually runs 2:07....my run out
groove info is '58C-371-1'
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jimct
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| Posted: 20 April 2013 at 8:27am | IP Logged
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I just my pulled Atco 6127 45 out, to provide deadwax info for Ed, and
something has caught my eye about my 45 this time, that didn't last time.
The typeface used. It doesn't appear to me to be the typical, late 50's,
much bolder typeface I'm used to seeing. The one I have looks more like a
1967-ish style typeface, like they used for the Buffalo Springfield and the
early Bee Gees releases. The vinyl for this 45 also has a "60's" look/feel to
it - the late 50's Atco 45s struck me as being a bit heavier.
I don't ever before remember Atlantic/Atco pressing up re-issue 45s on
anything other than their "Golden Oldies" series. But perhaps I've always
been mistaken about this. The deadwax info on here is "58 - C - 3040 -
X". There is also an "AT" and an "X", found elsewhere in the deadwax.
Perhaps our "pressing plant guru", Yah Shure, or someone else can shed
some light. Did Atco ever re-press old hit 45s, using the original stock
#s, and using the classic, half-yellow/half-white label?
Edited by jimct on 20 April 2013 at 8:29am
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Yah Shure
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| Posted: 20 April 2013 at 9:09pm | IP Logged
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Jim, Atlantic/Atco's best-selling 45s remained in print right up until the introduction of the gold-and-black Oldies Series reissues in the mid-'70s. Circa 1970-'71, the catalog 45s began to show up in their own white sleeves with black print. One side had "ATLANTIC GOLDEN OLDIES" on the top, with dozens of artists and titles listed - mostly just the A-sides - with their original catalog numbers in parentheses. On the reverse side: "ATCO GOLDEN OLDIES", same deal with the catalog numbers, but with fewer titles listed. The records that shipped in these sleeves were on the familiar labels still in use at the time (red-and-black Atlantics, yellow-and-white Atcos), still sporting the original catalog numbers and original A/B-side couplings.
In 1967, the bottom perimeter printing on the Atco 45s changed from "Divison of ATLANTIC RECORDS, New York, N.Y." (with an added "1841 B'way" on some Specialty pressings) to "MFG. BY ATLANTIC RECORDING CORP., 1841 BROADWAY, NEW YORK, N.Y." This change also applied to the Golden Oldies, which otherwise remained the same until the conversion to the gold-and-black Oldies Series. At that time, the original catalog numbers were dropped and the A/B pairings were mostly (but not always) reconfigured to back-to-back hits. The sleeves were updated to a white-with-orange-print design, though still branded ATLANTIC GOLDEN OLDIES / ATCO GOLDEN OLDIES on their respective sides, but with fewer titles and no catalog numbers listed at all. Oddly enough, Atlantic's old PLaza 7 phone number prefix was left intact: "(212) PL 7-6306. Now that was a golden oldie!
The first Atco 45 I picked up in the white-with-black-print Golden Oldies sleeve was Jorgen Ingmann's "Apache" in 1972. It was a Plastic Products pressing with "Echo Boogie" on the flip; yellow-and-white label, catalog # still 45-6184, with the then-current "MFG. BY ATLANTIC RECORDING CORP..." bottom perimeter designation. Atlantic/Atco didn't indicate pressing plant suffixes on the labels back when "Queen Of The Hop" or "Apache" were first issued; similarly, my '72 Apache has no pressing plant suffix indicated on the label, even though Atco had been listing them on current releases since late 1966 (the last Atco 45 I have without the label suffix is #6452, Buffalo Springfield's "Burned." #6459 does show a label pressing plant suffix on "For What It's Worth.")
Jim, as you noted, the label fonts also changed over the years, with all of the pressing plants eventually switching to different typefaces and thicknesses. My vinyl copy of "Queen Of The Hop" has the letters widely spaced on the word "VOCAL" as well as Bobby Darin's name. My Monarch styrene pressing of "Things" also has Bobby's name widely spaced. The edges of the records, themselves, can also often indicate vintage: the late-'50s and early-'60s Plastic Products pressings characteristically have a more rounded-off edge than the flat-edged 45s the company produced from about 1965 until its shuttering in 1977.
The deadwax matrix numbers generally wouldn't show any significant changes between early and later pressings. Occasionally, the original stampers remained in service well into the gold-and-black Oldies Series.
Some of the 1950s Atlantic R&B titles even managed to hang onto their original yellow-and-black labels and catalog numbers into the 1980s. I have both an original and early-'80s reissue of Clyde McPhatter & The Drifters' "What'cha Gonna Do" / "Gone." The differences are immediately apparent, beginning with the title and artist fonts. The original 45 is pressed on that heavy, hissy plastic of the day, there is no printing along the bottom perimeter of the label and the Atlantic logo has no pinwheel.
The reissue includes an -SP pressing plant suffix, is missing the "VOCAL QUARTET" genre description, and is credited to writer Ahmet Ertegun (the original lists a backwards "Nugetre.") The reissue also has the standard "MFG. BY ATLANTIC RECORDING CORP., 1841..." bottom perimeter printing, and the vinyl is likewise of contemporary vintage.
Edited by Yah Shure on 20 April 2013 at 9:16pm
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jimct
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| Posted: 20 April 2013 at 10:12pm | IP Logged
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Many thanks, John. I hadn't started buying reissue 45s with any regularity
until around 1974. I remember seeing the gold/black Atlantic/Atco Oldies
Series 45s from the very start of me buying them. I was allowed full access to
the "45 wall", at my local Mom and Pop store back in the day. I browsed a ton
of 45s then, and just don't recall seeing any original-looking Atlantic/Atco
45s coming with an "Oldies Series" sleeve. (Many they were selling so well
back then, they often had to re-order them.) I 100% believe you, sir. To me,
your knowledge on this subject is both much appreciated, and beyond
reproach.
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KentT
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| Posted: 13 May 2013 at 8:00pm | IP Logged
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Do remember many early pressings of Oldies Series 45 singles and many of them until very late in the lineup used old original stampers in their pressings. Sometimes distributors ordered so many copies of a single, they had original pressings for many years in their back stock and shipped them out when ordered. Some old hits on Atlantic/Atco I could buy original pressings of even 20 years later on if back stock existed.
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: Bobby Darin-"Queen Of The Hop"
