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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 08 April 2013 at 1:36am | IP Logged
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My commercial 45, which is mono and confirmed as Atlantic
A-2518, has a listed time of (2:15), and has an actual
time of (2:15). However, I bring this up because all CDs
have about the same time except that the 45 is sped up and
starts to fade at the point when the sound on the other
versions end. So, the 45 has five seconds more musical
content.
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davidclark
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| Posted: 08 April 2013 at 10:56pm | IP Logged
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sad that this is one of several Aretha 45s not available on CD in its 45
version/mix. Surprising that such a key (Atlantic, soul) artist has not had a
mono singles CD done for her.
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MMathews
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| Posted: 09 April 2013 at 5:32pm | IP Logged
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David,
It's possible they haven't got all the mono masters.
I recall years ago in the BSN newsletter, Mike Callahan
interviewed someone from Atlantic re-issue camp (don't
remember who, may have been Bill Inglot, but not sure) -
they were discussing the various CD releases, and the
Atlantic fire.
He said they still had much of the 50's and early 60's
are intact, including multitracks.
But sadly, tapes covering mid-60's to early 70's were
devastated.
This is why the Queen Of Soul box was a mix of sources.
Many masters were replaced off album reels located
elsewhere, like V/A comps, and album safety copies.
Groups like The Drifters have been treated to CD sets
sourced from multi's - and they certainly wanted to give
Aretha the same treatment, but the tapes are all gone.
Just like Universal, i'd hope Rhino would look overseas
for replacements, if that is possible.
MM
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 09 April 2013 at 5:52pm | IP Logged
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Thanks for the info, Mark. I only stared subscribing to
the BSN newsletter in late 1990, and that interview may
have come out earlier, or I missed it.
There aren't too many of her 60s singles that didn't make
it to CD, but this is one of them. I'm glad I found a
clean 45 of "Think" in a used record store. I have a
nice, clean digital transfer of it that I use on my
comps.
45 RPM singles are valuable. We, as collectors, should
do our best to preserve what we can because we can't rely
on the labels to do it.
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edtop40
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| Posted: 10 April 2013 at 3:37pm | IP Logged
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that's odd, hits man....i pitched up the 'queen of soul' cd
version very slightly and the pitch matches the vinyl 45
and runs exactly the same at 2:15........the vinyl cd has a
more gradual fade than the vinyl 45....but they run the
same speed and time...........are there two vinyl
45's??....my run out groove etching is 'A-14310-24 delta
sign 71369'
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 11 April 2013 at 7:42pm | IP Logged
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My guess is that there are two pressings that use
different tapes for masters. I can send you a copy if you
want.
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edtop40
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| Posted: 12 April 2013 at 11:33am | IP Logged
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hitsman....what is the etching in the run out groove of
your vinyl 45?
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 12 April 2013 at 5:43pm | IP Logged
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A-14319-1A
The other marking is CP
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Yah Shure
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| Posted: 12 April 2013 at 8:56pm | IP Logged
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Although I have several other late-'60s cutout titles, "Think" was the only time I ever encountered a current Columbia Pitman-pressed Atlantic 45 in the Twin Cities, so it's possible there was a disruption in the pipeline among Atlantic's usual manufacturers when it was issued.
The actual time on my copy j-u-s-t makes it to 2:16; Deadwax is "CP" "A-14319-1B" ; and a single, indecipherable character. Union rules then in effect at CBS mandated that Columbia Records Custom Division handle the mastering in addition to the pressing, which explains why multiple "Think" masterings exist (same story with the Turtles' White Whale 45s pressed by Monarch and Columbia.) Ed's Monarch pressing and the other (non-Columbia) manufacturers would have utilized Atlantic's in-house mastering.
I only have "Think" on CD via the 1986 2-CD 30 Greatest Hits, where it also runs an actual 2:16. The speed is slower than the 45.
Speed differences aside, the Pitman-pressed 45 does have some added length, but I only detect about 1.4 seconds of unique content extending beyond the cutoff of the CD track's fade. As Grant pointed out, the fade on the 45 does start later, but unlike Ed's 45, the fade is actually more gradual than the one on the CD (which quickly fades to a very low volume, then rides along at that barely-audible level for its final four seconds.)
In terms of practical listening, the combination of the later start of the 45's fade, its less-steep curve and that extra 1.4-second length makes it appear to run almost four seconds longer than the CD track.
Edited by Yah Shure on 12 April 2013 at 9:00pm
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 12 April 2013 at 11:02pm | IP Logged
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Sometimes it's just better to show you what i'm talking
about. Here's the last few seconds of my 45:
http://ppl.ug/WiVmnQewt5Q/
Cut and paste the URL into your browser.
Edited by The Hits Man on 12 April 2013 at 11:03pm
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edtop40
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| Posted: 17 April 2013 at 7:46pm | IP Logged
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hits man, can you send me an mp3 of the full vinyl 45
version of yours...i want to compare it to my vinyl
45....thanks edtop40
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 18 April 2013 at 11:37pm | IP Logged
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edtop40 wrote:
hits man, can you send me an mp3 of the
full vinyl 45
version of yours...i want to compare it to my vinyl
45....thanks edtop40 |
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You have a PM.
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edtop40
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| Posted: 19 April 2013 at 6:19pm | IP Logged
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hits man sent me a copy of his vinyl 45 and it sounds
identical to mine....they both run 2:15 and are the same as
the cd versions.....the only difference is that the fade is
slightly different as far as volume and not content.....i
stand by my original assessment of the song.....hits man
you may want to amend your original post that the vinyl 45
runs 0:05 longer than the cd versions, because that is not
factually accurate....
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 19 April 2013 at 9:54pm | IP Logged
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If both the stereo and mono 45 run at the same length of
time, but one contains five extra seconds of music, it
means that the 45 is faster. That is a fact. I can hear
it, too. I stand by my words.
The fade on the 45 is different. With the way you guys
are about fine details, you should take this as
significant. The differences are substantial enough for
me to continue to prefer the 45.
Oh, the mono mix sounds better and doesn't have that tape
hiss. The first line of the first verse where she sings
"Let's go back, let's go back, let's go way on way back
when.", the fader isn't suddenly bumped up on the phrase
"On way back when." on the 45 as it is on the stereo mix,
which also suggests that it is a dedicated mono mix.
Edited by The Hits Man on 19 April 2013 at 10:01pm
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edtop40
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| Posted: 20 April 2013 at 4:27am | IP Logged
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when the two mono vinyl 45 versions i listened to and the
slightly sped up stereo version i created all run 2:15....i
just can't see how any of them run 0:05 longer......but, i
guess we'll just agree to disagree..........hits man,
thanks for your help in getting to the bottom of this...
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: Aretha Franklin - "Think"
