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NightAire
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| Posted: 22 June 2011 at 6:37pm | IP Logged
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Does anybody know of a source for Billboard's "Hot Soul Singles" (1980 - 1982) and their "Hot Black Singles" (1982 - 1989) charts?
I don't know that the chart in either form had a year-end chart, but that would be ideal.
I've checked Joel Whitburn's site and it doesn't look like he does the charts on DVD like he does the Top Pop Singles charts, and the only book I saw looked like an alphabetical listing of all songs from 1942 - 1990-something... more than I need and not really helpful in determining what songs were hitting the rhythmic charts but not the pop charts between 1980 and 1989.
Anybody have any resources for this?
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eric_a
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| Posted: 22 June 2011 at 9:48pm | IP Logged
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Google Books has back issues of Billboard for free. If you don't mind poking around a bit, you can access most back issues from the 1980s.
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Paul Haney
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| Posted: 23 June 2011 at 4:17am | IP Logged
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Well, our current edition of "Hot R&B Songs" does show the peak Pop positions for each song (and a dash for those that didn't crossover). I believe that's the only source where you'll find all the information in one handy place. The 1980s had a TON of R&B hits that didn't make the Pop charts.
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80smusicfreak
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| Posted: 23 June 2011 at 1:48pm | IP Logged
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NightAire wrote:
| I don't know that the chart in either form had a year-end chart, but that would be ideal. |
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Ah, seems I'm not alone among the members of this chat board after all. :-) Sounds like what you're essentially seeking is an "R&B/Hip-Hop Annual" of the "Billboard" charts. I know you're relatively new here, but guess what??? More than five-and-a-half years ago now - all the way back on 24 November 2005 - I posted my (still) strong desire to Paul Haney on this board to somehow convince Mr. Whitburn to FINALLY publish just such a book! At that time, Whitburn had already come out w/ a "Country Annual" for fans of that genre - which I actually now have, despite not being huge into country, nor owning any of his other country chart books (and I've bought at least 25 of Mr. Whitburn's RR books over the last 25 years as a music collector). But more than half a decade later, still no such luck for us r&b fans... :-(
As a huge fan/collector of '70s & '80s r&b (just as much as pop), being able to analyze which r&b hits charted (and just how well) on the "Hot 100" is a big part of - but definitely not the only reason - why I'd like to see an "R&B/Hip-Hop Annual" published as well. While 1998's "Country Annual" sadly lacked such pop crossover info, looking at its page formatting, a column showing which r&b hits also made (or "Bubbled Under") the "Hot 100" - using the same "number/dash" system - could easily replace the "$" column. (The "$" info would be more relevant for the "Hot Country Songs" and "Hot R&B Songs" books, IMHO, where that has also been included before, although not necessarily in the most recent editions.) Or, looking at the page formatting in the most recent version of the "Hot 100 Annual", I wouldn't mind seeing the pop crossover info replace the "Time" column (or perhaps rotate this info if future editions of an "R&B/Hip-Hop Annual" are ever published)...
Paul Haney is right in that there were a lot of r&b hits that failed to cross over to the pop chart during the '80s - more so than any other decade, I believe. Of course, that was primarily due to the disco backlash of the early '80s, when suddenly about the only r&b hits that managed to cross over to pop were either ballads or straight funk tunes. (Country & AC hits quickly moved in to fill that void until about 1983-84, when Michael Jackson, Prince, and Lionel Richie started to bring r&b back, followed by rap and new jack swing in the late '80s). And that is what has partly made collecting '80s r&b hits a bit more difficult, and constantly having to flip through a book that covers artists alphabetically (i.e., "Hot R&B Songs") makes it very hard to focus on certain eras, since I have no interest in collecting all songs that charted r&b over the last 70 years (since 1942)...
I see that coming in August is a new book from RR, titled "Top 10 R&B Hits", which they're boasting "Includes the first-ever R&B Annual!" But alas, having read the description and checked the sample pages, I'm afraid the "annual" portion of this new addition to the RR catalog doesn't even come close to what I've been wanting for some 15-20 years now. :-( Looks like us r&b fans are just going to have to wait that much longer... (*sigh*)
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Must-play '80s song of the day (r&b non-crossover edition, just for NightAire - and if you don't already have it, track it down, lol):
"I'm Billie Jean, and I'm mad as hell/
I'm a woman with a story to tell..."
(clues: 1983; female vocals; charted U.S. r&b, but not pop)
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aaronk
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| Posted: 23 June 2011 at 3:55pm | IP Logged
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(deleted)
Edited by aaronk on 23 June 2011 at 3:57pm
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Aaron Kannowski
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Paul Haney
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| Posted: 24 June 2011 at 5:59am | IP Logged
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80smusicfreak wrote:
Must-play '80s song of the day (r&b non-crossover edition, just for NightAire - and if you don't already have it, track it down, lol):
"I'm Billie Jean, and I'm mad as hell/
I'm a woman with a story to tell..."
(clues: 1983; female vocals; charted U.S. r&b, but not pop) |
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"Superstar" by Lydia Murdock (#58 R&B hit in 1983). What do I win:)
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The Hits Man
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| Posted: 25 June 2011 at 6:22pm | IP Logged
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I've been using the Joel Whitburn's "Top R&B Singles" book
for more than a decade.
Like a couple of you guys, I am a huge fan and collector of
70s and 80s R&B.
Edited by The Hits Man on 25 June 2011 at 6:23pm
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80smusicfreak
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| Posted: 28 June 2011 at 3:05pm | IP Logged
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Paul Haney wrote:
80smusicfreak wrote:
Must-play '80s song of the day (r&b non-crossover edition, just for NightAire - and if you don't already have it, track it down, lol):
"I'm Billie Jean, and I'm mad as hell/
I'm a woman with a story to tell..."
(clues: 1983; female vocals; charted U.S. r&b, but not pop) |
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"Superstar" by Lydia Murdock (#58 R&B hit in 1983). What do I win:) |
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Ha! Actually, some 10-12 years ago (long before this site launched in '04), I did hold some '70s/'80s lyric contests on the message boards at a couple other sites that I used to frequent back in the day, and gave away some rare and/or out-of-print music prizes to the winner. However, that was back when the internet was still fairly young, and the incredible number of music-lyric sites that now exist today had yet to proliferate. At that time, you could pretty much get the lyrics to only the biggest and/or most classic pop hits; much more obscure tunes like "Superstar" were nowhere to be found. So back then, it wasn't anywhere near as easy to cheat - you primarily had to rely on your memory, as well as your knowledge and love of music, which was what seemed to make it fun for most of the folks who participated (and back then, I tended to rely on pop hits that made the top 40, but didn't go as high as the top 10 - just big enough so that the lyrics would likely ring a bell w/ most folks, but might not be able to immediately place them)...
And actually, the first (and last) time I posted some "mystery lyrics" on this chat board a full two years ago (Billy Satellite's minor 1984 pop gem, "Satisfy Me"), I actually went on Google before coming here, and much to my surprise, COULDN'T find a lyric site that included it, which was partly why I ended up choosing that particular song. :-) But by the time Santi Paradoa inquired about it last year (no one had yet to post the answer), it seems that w/ a few keystrokes, aaronk stated that he WAS able to find it through Google - or maybe he just used a different "Google" site, lol...
So how 'bout a gold star for correctly i.d.'ing "Superstar"??? :-) Great tune that SHOULD have also been a big (or at least moderate) pop hit, but for whatever reason, failed to cross over - for folks who haven't heard it, it was an answer song to Michael Jackson's 1983 smash, "Billie Jean", w/ a VERY similar beat. And in the event you might now want to get your hands on it, to the best of my knowledge, I'm afraid it has yet to appear on any U.S. CD to date; however, I do have it on a couple of legit European V/A compilations (was a top 20 hit in the U.K.)...
At any rate, my personal enjoyment of music (and therefore, buying & collecting habits) has always stretched well beyond the top 40; if anything, I choose to make my boundaries based on when the music came out (heavy on the '70s & '80s, w/ some '60s & '90s thrown in, and practically nothing from the '50s or '00s), and genre (heavy on pop/rock, soul/r&b, and dance/funk/disco, w/ some country and early rap mixed in). IMHO, there was a TON of stuff that missed the pop top 40 (or the charts altogether) that was just as good as anything that DID make the pop top 10 - the difference in the likability between a #101 hit and a #5 hit often isn't anywhere near as great as most people think. (Ever hear this minor 1981 pop hit that could've easily done better??? "Uh, my name is uh, Eugene/I'm a cool dude in a loose mood...") However, that being said, I've always found that using the charts certainly makes a great tool/starting point for expanding my collection, but it definitely doesn't end there... :-)
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AndrewChouffi
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| Posted: 28 June 2011 at 5:51pm | IP Logged
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To 80sMusicFreak:
Crazy Joe & The Variable Speed Band.
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crapfromthepast
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| Posted: 29 June 2011 at 7:00am | IP Logged
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"Eugene" got a surprising amount of play in the early days
of Z100/New York, in the summer of 1983. Originally
released on indie Mumbo Records in 1980, picked up by
Casablanca in 1981, got as high as #105 in Feb 1981. Co-
written & co-produced by Ace Frehley of Kiss. More than
you need to know, but that's what we're for. :)
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80smusicfreak
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| Posted: 29 June 2011 at 8:53am | IP Logged
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crapfromthepast wrote:
"Eugene" got a surprising amount of play in the early days
of Z100/New York, in the summer of 1983. Originally
released on indie Mumbo Records in 1980, picked up by
Casablanca in 1981, got as high as #105 in Feb 1981. Co-
written & co-produced by Ace Frehley of Kiss. More than
you need to know, but that's what we're for. :) |
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Yep, that's the one - and since unlike me, most of you folks here are such "45 enthusiasts", I'm surprised you didn't add that Casablanca actually issued two different promo 45s for "Eugene", w/ different lengths/versions on them. (I have copies of both, but they're packed away at the moment, so I don't have the particulars. Not sure if there were two different commercial 45s as well, although I do have one of those, too - oh, and also the 12" on Casablanca, but not the original on Mumbo.) ;-) Glad to know there are at least a few other folks here who have and/or remember it - although on a site like this, which obviously caters to people like myself who own such extensive music collections, I'm not too surprised. I never heard it on the radio myself back in the day (lived in SoCal at the time), but I've heard that it also got moderate to extensive airplay in the Boston area in 1980-81, where "Crazy Joe" Renda was originally from...
And BTW, I have yet to find "Eugene" on a legitimate/commercial CD, domestic or import; by chance is anyone here aware of one??? However, I DO have the song on an original Dr. Demento radio show CD, as well as a different/extended version on a collection of KISS-related rarities (again, as cftp noted, due to the Ace Frehley connection), but that one is a bootleg, and likely recorded from vinyl (although it sounds pretty good on that CD, at least to my ears)...
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jimct
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| Posted: 29 June 2011 at 12:42pm | IP Logged
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Wow, 80smusicfreak, we also played, as a "secret weapon" (but did not
report to the trade mags - you could get away with that in 1981!)
"Eugene", in standard medium station rotation, for about a month or so,
at our Top 40 station here in CT, even though we leaned AC from 80-82.
This was in '81, when it was only on Mumbo, before the offiicial
Casablanca release. And we weren't doing much "spiking" during this era,
believe me. It's a novelty record with a strong "NYC/Eastern dialect lean",
so I'm not the least bit surprised that no one out west ever touched it.
And since I liked it and we played it, I scored a copy back then, still own
it, and just pulled my mint Mumbo 12" of "Eugene" (CJ1183, listed time
4:11), with "Stranded In The Jungle" and "Little Puffies" on the other side; I
never saw a 45 issued on Mumbo. In small print, the 12" label says
"Eugene" by 'Crazy Joe' Renda under license from Polygram Special
Products", with a 1980 Casablanca Record & Filmworks copyright, so it
appears that Casablanca "proper" always owned the rights, but initially
passed on issuing it themselves. And, as indicated earlier in the thread,
someone from the record company wrote in magic marker on the plain
white 12" sleeve, "Top 5 request record at Z-100 (NYC)". And, although a
quick search just now didn't turn it up, I also own the later Casablanca 45
of it. When it does surface, i'll report details. And I'll also put making a
cherry vinyl dub of my mint 12" on this summer's personal to-do list, for
anyone interested.
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: Hot Soul Singles & Hot Black Singles
