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80smusicfreak
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| Posted: 17 December 2014 at 3:54pm | IP Logged
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The listings in the on-line database for this second-biggest(!) pop hit from the Godfather of Soul are somewhat of a mess, and much to my surprise, it appears no one here has ever attempted to tackle it (not even a thread dedicated to this song previously!). However, I believe I actually have it all straightened out... :-)
According to the db, FOUR different versions of "Living in America" have appeared on U.S. CDs to date - yet only one of those has a precise descriptor in the listings, so time to sort them all out:
1) The shortest version runs (4:07). This is the 45 version, which was released in November of 1985 (but peaked in early '86); it was the second single off the soundtrack to the film Rocky IV. Pat accurately shows all appearances of this one in the db as the "(45 version)", so no changes necessary here...
Okay, this is where things now get muddy, and I feel all the subsequent descriptors should be revised...
2) The next version in length runs (4:41)-(4:42). This is the version that appeared on the song's original parent album, the O.S.T. to Rocky IV, which was released in October of 1985. The original pressings of the soundtrack were issued on Scotti Brothers 40203, through CBS (and that applies to all three formats - i.e., vinyl LP, cassette, & CD). And indeed, Pat has that version of the CD in the db already, along w/ the subsequent re-issues on Scotti Brothers 75420 and Volcano/Legacy 75989. However, at this time, the descriptor on these merely reads "(LP version)". While that's not inaccurate, for reasons I'll describe under the next version of the song, I believe it would be better if the descriptor for all appearances of this one was changed to either "(O.S.T. Rocky IV LP version)" or perhaps "(Rocky IV soundtrack version)" - whichever works better...
3) The second-longest version runs (5:56)-(5:57). JB's next studio album following the Rocky IV soundtrack was Gravity, released in September of 1986. Rather than feature either the 45 version or the Rocky IV soundtrack version of "Living in America", the label instead opted to debut this nearly six-minute "remixed" version on the album. (After all, why WOULDN'T the label want to try and sell more copies of Brown's new album by including a previously-unreleased version of what proved to be his biggest hit in years, even if it was some 7-8 months after the fact???) The original pressings of Gravity were issued on Scotti Brothers 40380, again through CBS (and again, in all three formats - i.e., vinyl LP, cassette, & CD). However, I see that Pat does NOT currently show this original pressing in the db - only the subsequent re-issues on Scotti Brothers 5212 & 75212, Volcano 32044, and Sony Music Custom Marketing Group 748254. At this time, there's one used copy of the original 1986 U.S. CD on Scotti Brothers ZK 40380 listed on eBay, and complete w/ detailed photos: JAMES BROWN - "Gravity" (original CD) Currently, Pat uses only the word "(remixed)" to describe this version in the db; I feel it should instead be changed to "(Gravity LP version)" for all appearances - thus distinguishing it from the Rocky IV soundtrack version, while also defining its origin...
4) The longest version runs (6:31), and has appeared on only one CD to date: 2011's S.O.U.L., on Sony Music Commercial Music Group 784251. While I don't own the CD myself, I see that the back insert on S.O.U.L. specifically identifies this mix as the "(R&B Dance Version)". Well, guess what??? That was how the A-side of the U.S. commercial 12" single was labeled - it was released on Scotti Brothers 05310, w/ a printed time of "6:30", and came complete w/ a picture jacket. (The B-side featured an instrumental version and the Rocky IV LP version.) Page on Discogs, w/ photos: JAMES BROWN - "Living in America" (U.S. commercial 12" single) It was released in December of 1985 in support of the Rocky IV soundtrack, and had a run of 10 weeks on the dance chart in Billboard during January, February, & March of '86, peaking at #3. Pat also has this version currently labeled in the db as only "(remixed)"; while I admittedly don't own the 12" single, either, I feel that based on this evidence, it would be safe to change the descriptor to "(commercial 12" version)" instead...
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budaniel
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| Posted: 17 December 2014 at 4:46pm | IP Logged
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Note that in 2012, the label BBR reissued Gravity--the 12" mix, the soundtrack version, and instrumental version are included as bonus tracks. reissue
Edited by budaniel on 17 December 2014 at 4:55pm
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aaronk
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| Posted: 17 December 2014 at 5:30pm | IP Logged
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Thanks for all the details on this one. I do see your point about the two
LPs, but would Gravity really be considered a "parent LP" for "Living In
America"? I only ask because 1) it already has a parent LP (the
soundtrack), and 2) it was released several months after the song's
chart run. I'm sure there are several cases where a remixed version of
a hit song appears on a later LP (like the many "remix albums" that
came out in the '90s by Bobby Brown, Paula Abdul, Bell Biv Devoe,
etc.), yet those versions are only designated in the database as
"remixed."
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crapfromthepast
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| Posted: 17 December 2014 at 7:25pm | IP Logged
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Thanks for sorting this one out.
My 45 came with a picture sleeve that prominently displayed Rocky IV, so I always associate this song with the movie soundtrack. I know you can edit the soundtrack version down to get the 45 version, but I don't have my notes on where the edit points are. (Let me know if there's interest in having me reverse-engineer my own edit!)
For what it's worth, in my own library, I use Virgin EMI Polygram UK's 2-CD Now 1986 (1993) for the 4:42 soundtrack LP version. For the 45 edit, I have a homemade edit I did many years ago from the Rocky IV soundtrack CD (which I no longer own).
Edited by crapfromthepast on 19 December 2014 at 8:36am
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80smusicfreak
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| Posted: 18 December 2014 at 5:38am | IP Logged
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budaniel wrote:
| Note that in 2012, the label BBR reissued Gravity--the 12" mix, the soundtrack version, and instrumental version are included as bonus tracks. reissue |
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Yes, I discovered that while researching some of the details for my original post above, and admit that I wasn't aware of its existence previously. (Love how Amazon says the album is by the "Art of Noise" at the link you provided, lol.) I did notice how they took all three versions of "Living in America" that were featured on the original 1985 U.S. commercial 12" single (Scotti Brothers 05310) and included them as bonus tracks, which I thought was pretty cool - in fact, the only version of the song missing from that 2012 re-issue of Gravity is the (4:07) U.S. 45 version. The only reason I didn't mention that CD myself was because it's a U.K. import, and is thus ineligible for inclusion in the db. As a huge fan/collector of '70s & '80s soul/r&b, I personally think that Big Break Records (BBR) and Funky Town Grooves (FTG) are currently the two best labels going in the genre, and it's a shame we don't have anything like them here in the States (even if FTG is slowly expanding its number of releases in America)...
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80smusicfreak
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| Posted: 18 December 2014 at 6:02am | IP Logged
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aaronk wrote:
| Thanks for all the details on this one. I do see your point about the two LPs, but would Gravity really be considered a "parent LP" for "Living In America"? I only ask because 1) it already has a parent LP (the soundtrack), and 2) it was released several months after the song's chart run. I'm sure there are several cases where a remixed version of a hit song appears on a later LP (like the many "remix albums" that came out in the '90s by Bobby Brown, Paula Abdul, Bell Biv Devoe, etc.), yet those versions are only designated in the database as "remixed." |
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Actually, your question DID cross my mind while I was typing up my original post above. However, the more I thought about it, the more I felt it did qualify, especially since it wasn't a "best of..." or "greatest hits" collection, or one of those "remix albums" that you brought up - in other words, because it was a new STUDIO album, and no other albums had come out from JB during the short interim. Ultimately, I believe it's up to the user to decide what they want to do w/ the info. (Yes, I also believe there are likely a few other examples out there, and in those cases, I feel they should be updated, too, not just for the additional info, but for the sake of consistency as well - but NOT in those cases where we're dealing w/ hits collections or remix albums.) I don't think there's any disputing that Gravity IS the origin of the (5:56)-(5:57) version of "Living in America", so I certainly don't feel that my suggestion is untrue, or even misleading. And isn't the purpose of the descriptors in the db all about identifying origins and/or supplying other details??? Personally, I'd rather have the extra info, vs. simply "(remixed)"...
As I acknowledged in my original post, yes, if you want to split hairs, "Living in America"'s 19th and final week on Billboard's "Hot 100" chart was in the April 12, 1986, issue, while its 17th and final week on the magazine's r&b chart came a week later, in the April 19 issue, and that was before Gravity hit store shelves. In fact, as a result of your query, I just researched the origins of the Gravity album even further, and here's what I found: There was actually a fairly lengthy article by Paul Grein that appeared on pg. 20 of the April 5 issue of Billboard here. It was about how Dan Hartman - who produced & co-wrote "Living in America" - was on board to produce the entire Gravity album for JB, which was at that time slated for release in May (i.e., a mere 4-5 weeks after the song had fallen off the charts). Of course, that ultimately didn't happen - it was pushed back, and didn't drop here in the U.S. until September 23 (Billboard, September 6, 1986; pg. 88). A full-page ad for the album appeared in the September 27 issue (pg. 5), while Brian Chin reviewed it in his weekly "Dance Trax" column that same issue (pg. 59). A further review appeared in Chin's column the following week (October 4; pg. 33), as did the magazine's official review of the album (pg. 78). Gravity would then go on to debut at #168 on Billboard's "Top Pop Albums" chart in the October 18 issue...
So was "Living in America" completely gone from radio and the 45 not still available on store shelves five months after it fell out of the top 100, when Gravity finally hit the streets in late September??? (Clearly JB's label, Scotti Brothers, wasn't treating the song as an "oldie" by then!) And since songs are listed in the db by their year of peak popularity - and in this case, the album still dropped in that same year (i.e., 1986) - I'd hope that would be considered good enough to make the distinction I suggested. Also, if db subscribers who aren't that familiar w/ the song really want to know which was the first-released LP version, I'd think they could figure it out just by looking at the catalog nos. on the original pressings of the CDs - i.e., Scotti Brothers 40203 for the Rocky IV soundtrack, and Scotti Brothers 40380 for Gravity. Hey, if we're here, we all must be chart geeks and anal about numbers, right??? :-)
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aaronk
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| Posted: 18 December 2014 at 7:17am | IP Logged
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I'm also all for adding more detail to the database when possible. And I
wasn't arguing against making the change; I was simply raising the
question.
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80smusicfreak
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| Posted: 19 December 2014 at 12:01am | IP Logged
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aaronk wrote:
| I'm also all for adding more detail to the database when possible. And I wasn't arguing against making the change; I was simply raising the question. |
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Yes, and that was exactly how I interpreted your post. I suppose my response was a bit more in-depth than necessary - can you tell that I like looking through those old issues of Billboard magazine from the '80s??? :-) I see that Pat has already made all of the changes I suggested - that was quick!
aaronk wrote:
| I'm sure there are several cases where a remixed version of a hit song appears on a later LP (like the many "remix albums" that came out in the '90s by Bobby Brown, Paula Abdul, Bell Biv Devoe, etc.), yet those versions are only designated in the database as "remixed." |
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Not true, actually. By coincidence, while looking for something else in the db a few hours ago, I found at least one exception. Look up the Thompson Twins. In 1988, they released just such a remix album on Arista 8542, titled The Best of.../Greatest Mixes (bought the cassette myself, and still have it to this day). For all six top 40 hits featured on it - "Lies", "Hold Me Now", "Doctor! Doctor!", "Lay Your Hands on Me", "King for a Day", and "Get That Love" - you'll see that Pat currently uses the descriptor "('Best of/Greatest Mixes' LP version)" instead of "(remixed)". I haven't researched it myself, but unless any or all of those mixes can be traced back as original 12" versions from each song's respective year of release, I'm fine w/ the current descriptor, so I wouldn't ask Pat to change them - just saying that in the case of remix albums, the descriptor does indeed vary from artist to artist...
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995wlol
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| Posted: 10 May 2016 at 6:23pm | IP Logged
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Can anyone speak to the mastering of the "Living in America" 45 version that is on the "Playlist: The Very Best of James Brown" CD that came out last year? The Playlist series seems to generally refrain from applying extreme dynamic compression based on the few I discs have, but I'd like to be sure before I buy this one.
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995wlol
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| Posted: 04 January 2022 at 9:15pm | IP Logged
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995wlol wrote:
| Can anyone speak to the mastering of the "Living in America" 45 version that is on the "Playlist: The Very Best of James Brown" CD |
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I'll answer my own question here--got the Playlist CD years ago and "Living In America" is thoroughly brickwalled. Don't bother with this one.
Anyone have the edit points for the the 45 version?
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: James Brown - "Living in America"
