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aaronk
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| Posted: 10 April 2008 at 6:26pm | IP Logged
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My good friend jimct told me quite a funny story about the history of the Hot Productions label quite some time ago. While I don't remember all the details, the bottom line is that it's a sketchy label at best. With the recent metion of Hot Productions in another thread, it is very timely that I just received my first purchase of an album on Hot Productions.
Upon opening my sealed copy of The Best Of Enjoy! Records, I noticed something odd right away. I hadn't yet touched the disc, but there were fingerprints all over the label side of the disc. Also, from the top, I was suspicious that it was one of those shiny-top CD-Rs. My suspicions were confirmed when I checked the bottom of the disc!
For anyone else who has a Hot Productions CD, is it a factory pressed disc, or is it also a CD-R? I have yet to determine if the seller sold me a bootleg or if that's just how cheap the label is. After hearing Jim's story (which I hope he can share parts of it on the board), it wouldn't surprise me if they are just cheap.
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jimct
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| Posted: 10 April 2008 at 6:59pm | IP Logged
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Aaron, I'll capsulize the story I told you privately a while back. I own several "Hot Productions" CDs (although none are shiny top CD-Rs with fingerprints!!!) The unofficial scuttlebutt I was told in my travels was/is that Florida music business legend/one-hit wonder Steve Alaimo is/is involved with the "Hot Productions" CD label. I even have his "Steve Alaimo's Greatest Hits" CD on this label (he had many major label 45 releases in the 60's, and they got LOTS of 60's Florida Top 40 back in the day.) But they all sound like they were dubbed from scratchy 45s to me - same thing with a Dickie Goodman comp that I own on this label. To me, these two CD both appear to not be properly licensing tracks. On the other hand, Alaimo and T.K. label founder Henry Stone are allegedly very good friends, of many years, and my "Ritchie Family" comp, also on Hot Productions, does sound to me like it comes mainly from tape sources (probably provided by Stone as a favor, whose T.K./Marlin label originally released their 1976 hit, "The Best Disco In Town".) My overall assessment is that if there's a T.K./Associated label link to a group, a "Hot Productions" CD is probably mainly from a tape source. But if not, I'm 99% sure the CD contains obvious vinyl dubs, of dubious licensing origin, so I suggest you buy with caution!
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EdisonLite
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| Posted: 10 April 2008 at 11:48pm | IP Logged
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This is very interesting because it brings up the same situation for Renaissance Records. I bought the "Juice Newton Anthology" and "Louise Mandrell Anthology" directly from Renaissance through ebay and when I got them, both were CDRs! I've also gotten quite a few Renaissance CDs previously that were NOT CDRs. Anyway, I immediately asked the owner of Renaissance why my J Newton & L Mandrell CDs were CDRs, and he said it was because they ran out of the initial pressings and they couldn't afford the cost of running off another batch so now he basically just makes CDRs when someone wants to buy these CDs (but obviously he doesn't tell anyone ahead of time that they are CDR copies they'll be getting!)
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Fetta
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| Posted: 11 April 2008 at 8:37am | IP Logged
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I have many many Hot Productions CD's as they have released alot of disco labels comps. I've never had any problems with sound quality and up until several months ago, they all looked like regular cd's to me.......UNTIL......I recently bought (on ebay) SEALED copies of both Dickie Goodman Best of Fables CD's. To my surprise, they both looked like CDR's.
I always wondered if they were bootlegs or not but Pat does make note of them in the book and database. So I assumed they weren't but never understood why they were CDR's.
Edited by Fetta on 11 April 2008 at 10:14am
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Steve Sharp
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| Posted: 11 April 2008 at 11:42pm | IP Logged
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I think it's a sign of the times. As sales decline, instead of making batches of titles that may be warehoused for long periods of time, they sort of "press to order". I have several CDs on Hot that are cdrs.
I'd rather have a cdr than have a title go completely out of print.
Edited by Steve Sharp on 11 April 2008 at 11:43pm
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Todd Ireland
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| Posted: 18 April 2008 at 7:34pm | IP Logged
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EdisonLite wrote:
| This is very interesting because it brings up the same situation for Renaissance Records. I bought the "Juice Newton Anthology" and "Louise Mandrell Anthology" directly from Renaissance through ebay and when I got them, both were CDRs! I've also gotten quite a few Renaissance CDs previously that were NOT CDRs. Anyway, I immediately asked the owner of Renaissance why my J Newton & L Mandrell CDs were CDRs, and he said it was because they ran out of the initial pressings and they couldn't afford the cost of running off another batch so now he basically just makes CDRs when someone wants to buy these CDs (but obviously he doesn't tell anyone ahead of time that they are CDR copies they'll be getting!) |
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Drat! I'm glad I caught your post, Gordon, because I was about to purchase Lindisfarne's Anthology CD directly from the Renaissance label on eBay, but I certainly do NOT want to get stuck with a CD-R copy. I mean, if I wanted to buy the Lindisfarne album on a CD-R, I'd be better off just downloading my desired tracks from the MusicGiants retail website for less money and burning them onto CD-R myself. I'm not a big fan of storing music on CD-Rs to begin with because the discs often made from inferior materials compared to their silver factory-pressed commercial counterparts. I've heard numerous anecdotal stories about how CD-Rs can degrade into an unplayable condition in as little as a few years and this is why I prefer to purchase my music on silver factory-pressed commercial CDs when possible. Hmmm... I'm wondering if the Renaissance discs sold by other retailers are CD-Rs as well?
Edited by Todd Ireland on 18 April 2008 at 7:50pm
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aaronk
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| Posted: 19 April 2008 at 12:34am | IP Logged
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I'm nervous about the same thing when it comes to CD-Rs. I can tell you this much from experience, though. There are certain brands and colors of CD-R media that I avoid like a one-legged hooker (all hookers, for that matter).
I've been burned by Maxell, Sony, and Memorex for sure. Really, the only ones I trust are Taiyo Yuden, as I did lots of research, and they seem to be the only company that manufactures their own discs. All the other major brands outsource it to the same company. (In other words, for the most part there's no difference between many major brands since they all use the same manufacturer.)
I've had Taiyo Yuden discs for about five years now, and they still play without any issues. All the other ones that I've had trouble with have gone bad within two to three years. Also, I don't trust any discs that don't have a green bottom. The ones that are really, really light colored have caused me problems. Blue bottom and gold bottom discs have been absolutely terrible. Supposedly, the Taiyo Yuden (and I'm sure there are other brands that are just as good) discs will last for 100 years. I won't hold my breath, though.
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EdisonLite
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| Posted: 19 April 2008 at 1:08am | IP Logged
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Aaron, what problems exactly have you had with Maxell? I've used those and really don't run into problems. And I've had many for quite a few years. I also find TDK to be quite reliable (for me).
Maybe there are other factors in why we've had a different experience -- like maybe Maxell doesn't go well with your CD burner. And are you careful to never store your CDRs in hot places and do you never get fingerprints and scratches on them?
I have had the same experience you've had with Memorex and Sony. I would never use those.
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Todd Ireland
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| Posted: 19 April 2008 at 11:17am | IP Logged
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aaronk wrote:
I've been burned by Maxell, Sony, and Memorex for sure. Really, the only ones I trust are Taiyo Yuden, as I did lots of research, and they seem to be the only company that manufactures their own discs. All the other major brands outsource it to the same company. (In other words, for the most part there's no difference between many major brands since they all use the same manufacturer.)
I've had Taiyo Yuden discs for about five years now, and they still play without any issues. |
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Yes, I haven't had any problems yet with Taiyo Yuden CD-Rs either, Aaron, so hopefully time will continue to show they're the real deal. As you know, I too store my homemade DJ and 45 edits on Taiyo Yuden CD-Rs since those versions are obviously not available on silver factory-pressed commercial CDs. In addition, I strive to store my audio files on both a main and backup hard drive for additional security.
Edited by Todd Ireland on 19 April 2008 at 11:47am
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aaronk
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| Posted: 19 April 2008 at 5:20pm | IP Logged
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Hard drive back up is a great idea, Todd!
Gordon, I've had a number of Maxell's go bad for me, but most of them were manufactured with gold color dye. Additionally, the CDs tended to slightly bow in the center, causing the disc to not be flat any longer. My CDs are always stored in the jewel cases at room temperature, and none of them have scratches or fingerprints. I'm sure it's a manufacturing problem.
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Yah Shure
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| Posted: 19 April 2008 at 6:41pm | IP Logged
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I also back up my .wav vinyl restorations and CD edits as data files on DVD-Rs. If I need to get those files back on the hard drive, they can simply be copied from the DVD-R without going through a second ripping-to-.wav process.
I noticed about three years after I'd gotten my first CD-R burner in 1996 that I was beginning to have playback problems on my Sony CD-R discs. The problem was with the burner. The solution was to put the problem CD-Rs in the freezer for about half and hour, let them defog, then rip them to a new .wav file and re-archive them with a new burner.
Edited by Yah Shure on 19 April 2008 at 6:43pm
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aaronk
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| Posted: 19 April 2008 at 9:08pm | IP Logged
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Yah Shure wrote:
| The solution was to put the problem CD-Rs in the freezer for about half and hour, let them defog, then rip them to a new .wav file and re-archive them with a new burner. |
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I've tried this technique, too, and I figured out why it works. The problem CD-Rs I encountered, especially Sony, had a problem where the plastic wasn't flat (the bow in the center I mentioned above). The bow (or warp) became worse as the plastic warmed up. Cooling them off made the plastic slightly flatten out. I noticed that on these problem CD-Rs, it was mainly the last half of the disc that had the major problems. This, of course, was because as the laser got toward the outer part, it wasn't hitting the surface straight on any longer (because of the warp).
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Fetta
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| Posted: 24 April 2008 at 7:40am | IP Logged
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I am now taking all my CDs and putting them on an external hard drive.
I've noticed that I'm having problems ripping the last track on several of the CDs that I've burned over the years. As it is ripping the last track, it just stops in the middle.
These were CD-Rs that were burnt between 1998-2000 (back when I was spending $8-$10 per disc - then finally going down to $4, which I thought was a bargain) and are TDK discs.
Does anyone know why this is happening?
-Fetta
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aaronk
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| Posted: 24 April 2008 at 5:52pm | IP Logged
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I've never had a problem with those really old TDK discs (I think they had a dark green bottom), but you can tell if it's warped by setting it playing side up on a flat surface. If the center hole is not also laying flat, that could be why the laser isn't reading the last tracks. You might also try playing the last track in a regular CD player. Warped discs generally won't play in those players either.
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Top 40 Music on Compact Disc : Chat Board
Topic: CD-Rs on Hot Productions label?
