Top 40 Music on Compact Disc: Didn’t We Almost Have It All

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Topic: Didn’t We Almost Have It All - Whitney

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EdisonLite
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Posted: 21 August 2009 at 1:25am \| IP Logged

I'm bringing this subject (from another thread 4 years ago) into its own topic. Aaron wrote:

"Whitney Houston - Didn't We Almost Have It All - On the Greatest Hits CD, and on my TM Century library, this song sounds awful! The vocals are very distorted, and it sounds as if the tape was bad or like it was transfered from a bad vinyl source. It's noticable throughout the song, but it's really bad from the 3:30 point to the end...and especially at 4:08.
Does anyone know if the original Whitney album has this problem, too?>

At the time, I'd never noticed anything. After Aaron pointed it out, now whenever I listen (at least on headphones) the distortion does sound terrible. And it's even on the original CD - "Whitney". Aaron pointed out it's also on the edited version on the "Greatest Hits" CD. Tonight I tried to use X-crackle on most of the vocal distortion parts and probably reduced it by a third or so, but not nearly enough.

So does anyone know - is there an import CD that doesn't have distortion on this song? Funny that I never really noticed it before Aaron's post. Never even heard it on the CD back in 1987 when I played it frequently. Is it possible that CD rot caused the distortion on my CD (and other Whitney CDs made at the time) and that's why I didn't notice it then and do now? (But that doesn't explain why the Greatest Hits CD has the same problem - unless they edited it from an old Whitney CD). Could all the CDs have rotted?

aaronk
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Posted: 21 August 2009 at 7:45am \| IP Logged

I'm sure this has nothing to do with the CDs. Actually, the last time I listened, it sounded to me as if only the vocal track has the distortion issue, while the instrumentation is okay. If I had to guess, I'd say this song was mastered and/or recorded this way.

Roscoe
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Posted: 21 August 2009 at 8:14am \| IP Logged

aaronk wrote:

Right. I don't think CD rot would manifest as vocal distortion. I don't recall the distortion, but I haven't listened to this song in a while.

Possible culprits for distortion in a case like this would be either overload when recording the vocal (you know Whitney and her loud voice), or overloading the levels during the mix. However, it would be unusual to encounter technical flaws of this nature in a big budget production like this in 1987.

EdisonLite
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Posted: 21 August 2009 at 9:21am \| IP Logged

<it would be unusual to encounter technical flaws of this nature in a big budget production like this in 1987.>

I agree. But it looks like that's the case here. That means when Michael Masser (the song's producer) was mixing the song he either didn't notice the distortion or didn't care. The CD rot does NOT occur during the instrumental portions of the song so you're right, it can't be CD rot. And if it's this way on the "Whitney" CD, it must be this way on the master (unless it's NOT this way on the Whitney LP, but that's doubtful.) So if the master has it, all import CDs will have it, and it must have always aired this way on the radio.

aaronk
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Posted: 21 August 2009 at 10:11am \| IP Logged

Roscoe wrote:

Possible culprits for distortion in a case like this would be either overload when recording the vocal (you know Whitney and her loud voice), or overloading the levels during the mix.

I was suspicious of this at first; however, the distortion occurs not only in places where Whitney is belting out the notes, but also where she sings softer passages. I could see this being possible if the vocals were overmodulated going into a certain piece of equipment, such as a processor. Maybe the input gain was way set too high, which would still allow the levels to look "okay" on the output, during recording and mixdown. You would think that the engineer would've noticed the horrible sound, though, especially when playing the vocal back in "solo" mode.

I still think it's also possible that the multi-track tape was bad (near the outer edge, for instance, so that only one or a couple of tracks were affected).

sriv94
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Posted: 21 August 2009 at 2:57pm \| IP Logged

Anyone check the vinyl 45 or a cassette single to see if they too have this distortion?

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crapfromthepast
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Posted: 21 August 2009 at 5:52pm \| IP Logged

It's distorted on the 4:33 45 version on the UK The Hits Album 7 CD from 1987.

If it's got the distortion there, it's safe to say that the distortion will show up on every copy of the song, everywhere.

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bwolfe
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Posted: 23 August 2009 at 10:29am \| IP Logged

That one's on an Arista promo CD called Six Pack of Hits.
I'll have to dig it up and see what the quality is like on that one.
It must have been alright because it was our studio version when it was a hit in 1987.

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mainrhythm
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Posted: 09 December 2010 at 1:50pm \| IP Logged

fyi...This track on the vinyl LP of "Whitney" is also distorted.

NightAire
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Posted: 03 July 2011 at 11:55pm \| IP Logged

The DJ edit is painless to make from the "Whitney" CD:

Take out the 30 seconds between 3:53 and 4:22.

Ta-da! :-)

(And, the near-mint CD I found in a pawn shop here for a dollar last week sounds really gritty on this song, too... odd, since the first few tracks are so clean!)

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eric_a
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Posted: 14 April 2012 at 11:34pm \| IP Logged

bwolfe wrote:

That one's on an Arista promo CD called Six Pack
of Hits.

I picked up a copy of this disc today, and Whitney's vocal sounds
distorted to me here as well.

EdisonLite
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Posted: 24 October 2012 at 11:47pm \| IP Logged

OK, I have an update on this issue - from Sony itself. I've been helping them out with the reissue of Whitney's 1987 "Whitney" CD. Back in 2005, Aaron K brought it to all of our attention that "Didn't We Almost Have It All" had vocal distortion throughout much of the song. There was various speculation as to the cause of this.

With my working on the upcoming CD, I brought this issue to the attention of the Sony guy I'm working with. He found and checked all 6 mixdowns they had and all had the vocal distortion. His final effort was to have the multi-track tapes pulled to see if the the vocal distortion was recorded that way on the separated vocal track. Here's his response:

<Multi-tracks had the same vocal distortion. The mastering engineer did the best they can do to fix. It sounds fine.>

So basically, they took the two-track master and did some processes to lessen the distortion. At least now, we know Whitney's vocals were actually recorded this way, so there's no need to search for a distortion-free version on any CD. This remaster will probably be the best sounding one (though I haven't heard it.) At least, it's the only one where the distortion was attempted to be removed.

BTW, this deluxe edition will have 6 bonus cuts - three other songs released from the same time period, plus 3 previously unreleased songs that were also recorded during the late '80s.

budaniel
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Posted: 25 October 2012 at 8:36am \| IP Logged

Hey EdisonLite,

so I take it this is going to be a single disc release and not a much hoped for 2-disc release with the 12" versions of I Wanna Dance With Somebody, So Emotional, Love Will Save the Day, and For the Love Of You?

EdisonLite
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Posted: 25 October 2012 at 9:15am \| IP Logged

Yes. I, too, was hoping for a 2-disc set, much like the 25th anniversary release of Whitney's first album (which had a 2nd disc containing videos). It especially would have been nice to have all the 12" vinyl mixes of "I Wanna Dance" on one CD, instead of scattered about on 3 or more import CDs, as they were.

The 3 bonus cuts that were previously released are "One Moment In Time", "Moment of Truth" (the b-side of "I Wanna Dance"), and IIRC, a Jermaine Jackson duet from a Jermaine album (though it's not "If You Say My Eyes Are Beautiful".)

The 3 bonus cuts that are previously unreleased include 2 Michael Masser songs and a Winans song.

Brian W.
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Posted: 25 October 2012 at 9:43am \| IP Logged

EdisonLite wrote:

and IIRC, a Jermaine Jackson duet from a Jermaine album (though it's not "If You Say My Eyes Are Beautiful".)

Probably "Shock Me," which was the B-side of "Didn't We Almost Have It All."

Great to finally found out that the distortion was on the original recording.

Santi Paradoa
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Posted: 25 October 2012 at 4:19pm \| IP Logged

When can we expect this upcoming reissue Gordon?

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NightAire
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Posted: 25 October 2012 at 4:26pm \| IP Logged

As long as the reissue is not clipped to death, I'll have to pick this up. Thanks for the info!

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MMathews
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Posted: 25 October 2012 at 5:58pm \| IP Logged

The rarest form of a "deluxe" re-issue is the only one i
like:
either bonus tracks, OR a bonus disc containing all other
released versions of the albums tracks, meaning 45 edits,
12" single mixes, radio edits, B-sides etc. Once in
awhile i actually encounter one.
Most of the time, i see a bunch a "live" tracks.
Sorry, not interested.

The bonus tracks on this release are not bad, but in my
opinion, woefully incomplete.

EdisonLite
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Posted: 26 October 2012 at 10:44am \| IP Logged

Brian, Yes, "Shock Me" is the 3rd of the 3 previously released tracks. Santi, probably a January release but I don't think that's carved in stone. Gene, "Didn't We Almost ..." should be the best sounding version on this CD because it's the only one where an engineer consciously tried to remove the vocal distortion. Mark, yes a 2-disc set with all the 12" mixes would have been nice, but I believe all those 12" mixes came out on CD elsewhere, and what's really nice about this collection is that it contains THREE previously unreleased bonus cuts (!), and considering Whitney is no longer with us (and there were only 5 previously unreleased WH cuts in all the Sony vaults), and the fact that the 2 unreleased Michael Masser written/produced tracks are as GREAT as his released songs ("Greatest Love of All", "Didn't We Almost Have It All", "Saving All My Love For You", "All At Once") - will make this a treasured disc in my collection. And in all honesty, at the start of this project, I had no way of knowing if those unreleased songs would even be allowed to be included on this CD. There were so many steps where someone could have said No - the Whitney Houston estate/family, Clive Davis (the record label president), any of the publishers/writers - anyone of these entities could have said No, feeling the recording wasn't good enough, never fully completed, etc. etc. So I was glad all 3 got approved. As for the other unreleased stuff, my understanding is they're coming, too - in future releases like a boxed set or various "Essential" or "Ultimate Whitney" type releases. There will be an "Essential" type of CD release for this Christmas, but they won't have these 3 particular bonus cuts, and I haven't seen the track listing yet.

Edited by EdisonLite on 26 October 2012 at 10:47am

Todd Ireland
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Posted: 27 October 2012 at 10:06pm \| IP Logged

Fantastic info, Gordon! How cool is it to have a forum member here bring the "Didn't We Almost Have It All" distortion issue to the attention of the Sony people and an engineer responds in kind by actually trying to fix it! Now if there's any way you could gently suggest to them not to remaster "Didn't We Almost Have It All" and the rest of the Whitney album with excessively loud "brickwalled" audio levels, then I'd really be happy! ;-)

Edited by Todd Ireland on 27 October 2012 at 10:07pm

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