Top 40 Music on Compact Disc: Gary Glitter

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Topic: Gary Glitter - "Rock And Roll Part 2"

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crapfromthepast
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Posted: 05 March 2010 at 7:44pm \| IP Logged

I thought doing comparisons for this track would be relatively simple. Nope. At the very least, the designation of "45 length" and "LP length" need to be changed.

First I played my US 45 (Bell 45,237, Part 2 has printed 3:10, actual 3:10). It's mono on both sides.

Then assembled all 7 versions I have on CD to figure out what's what. It still doesn't quite make sense.

I found what I think are three different stereo mixes on CD, none of which really sound like the mono 45, and it's really difficult to describe them.

The first version to appear on CD was DCC's Toga Rock II (1989, mastered by Steve Hoffman). Very boomy drums, lots of processing on the vocals. Big delay in the vocals between L and R channels - R comes in first. (Listen to just the L channel vocals, and it's sounds like everything comes in just a little late.)

This same version crops up again (but doesn't sound quite as good) on Mystic Music Presents Good Times (1991), Time-Life's Sounds Of The Seventies - 1972 Take Two (1991) and Madacy's Rock On - 1972 (1996).

There's another, more dry mix on Time-Life's Guitar Rock - 1972-1973 (1994), which sounds like it has essentially no reverb on anything, especially when compared with the Toga Rock mix. The vocals have a lot less processing. It has slightly exaggerated highs, which leads me to think that it may be a clone of Rhino's 1991 Greatest Hits CD, and the sample I heard on Amazon confirms this.

And finally, there's the version on Rhino's Have A Nice Day Vol. 9, which doesn't match any of the above. The claps in the clap track are panned completely to the R channel and have a very different tone than all the others, and it's not an EQ difference. The vocals are panned hard right as well, with just a small amount of leakage into the L channel. What the heck?

And to complicate matters, none of the above three mixes really matches the 45. I guess Toga Rock comes closest, but there are still some differences in the effects used on the vocals, plus the 45 extends about 10 seconds beyond the end of the Toga Rock version.

I repeated the same exercise with the B-side, "Part 1" (which is the same song but with vocals). The 45 has vocals that sound kinda natural, while the version on Disky's Beat Goes On Vol. 3 (1997) has lots of processing that make the vocals sound kinda metallic.

I give up. :(

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Yah Shure
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Posted: 05 March 2010 at 8:46pm \| IP Logged

Don't you dare give up, Ron! Your volume-by-volume HAND dissection on the Steve Hoffman boards is much appreciated.

Unfortunately, the DJ 45 is of no additional help here, since both sides are the mono Part 2.

crapfromthepast
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Posted: 05 March 2010 at 8:50pm \| IP Logged

Anyone have the Bell LP? Or UK 45/LP?

eriejwg
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Posted: 06 March 2010 at 8:29pm \| IP Logged

Is the 45 a dedicated mono mix or a fold down?

aaronk
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Posted: 08 March 2010 at 10:27am \| IP Logged

I always thought it was a dedicated mix, as the CD versions I have do not fold down to sound like the mono. It seems there needs to be some further sorting of the various CD versions, though. Thanks for your new details, Ron!

Roscoe
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Posted: 08 March 2010 at 1:09pm \| IP Logged

crapfromthepast wrote:

I give up. :(

If you're referring to finding the best sounding "45 version" on CD, then that may indeed be an exercise in futility, unless it surfaces on an obscure import CD. For whatever reason, the longer 45 mix seems to have gone MIA in the CD era. Given this tune's resurrection as a sporting event anthem in the 90s, it is surprising that no one has issued the true 45 version on CD...maybe a case of missing tapes?

In any event, the analysis you have performed thus far is interesting and confirms my strategy of sticking with a needledrop of the 45.

Santi Paradoa
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Posted: 12 March 2010 at 10:56am \| IP Logged

BTW, Gary's only other US top 40 hit is on a third CD that is currently not in Pat's database. "I Didn't Know I Loved You" can be found on Sounds Of The Seventies - AM Heavy Hits (Time-Life SOD-37).

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aaronk
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Posted: 25 November 2010 at 8:27pm \| IP Logged

The database was never updated to reflect Ron's findings, and I don't think
we ever determined which version appears on the US LP.

mainrhythm
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Posted: 25 November 2010 at 11:25pm \| IP Logged

My LP has a printed time of 3:00 for Part 2. I will have to compare it to my 45 tomorrow.

edit: wow, the 45 sounds terrible. The LP version is stereo, has an actual time of 2:59 and sounds great.

Edited by mainrhythm on 26 November 2010 at 11:08pm

aaronk
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Posted: 28 November 2010 at 8:01pm \| IP Logged

Mainrhythm just sent me a dub of his vinyl LP, and it sounds like the same mix that is on the "Have A Nice Decade" box set. This is not the same stereo mix found on "Have A Nice Day, Vol. 9." I agree with Ron that the clap tracks have a different tone between these two mixes. When I have a chance, I'll also pull out my copy on "Those Rockin' 70s" to see if it matches any of the other versions I have.

crapfromthepast
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Posted: 29 November 2010 at 8:53pm \| IP Logged

Thanks to mainrhythm, who sent me a dub of the vinyl LP version, I can confirm that the more dry mix on Time-Life's Guitar Rock - 1972-1973 (1994) is the LP mix. It sounds like it has essentially no reverb on anything, especially when compared with the Toga Rock mix or the 45 mix. It's stereo, with the guitars mostly panned left and the vocals mostly panned right.

I still think that the GR disc may be a clone of Rhino's 1991 Greatest Hits CD, but I don't have the Rhino disc to compare.

KentT
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Posted: 08 December 2010 at 7:46am \| IP Logged

UK Bell 45 is a dedicated mono mix. Just scored one two weeks ago and cleaned it. Just played it. It is far superior sounding. And it is a superb, quiet, flat, well mastered EMI UK pressing. And centered too!

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crapfromthepast
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Posted: 16 April 2018 at 8:27pm \| IP Logged

Eight years later, I only have a teeny bit more info to share.

Toga Rock II mix

Very boomy drums, lots of processing on the vocals. Big delay in the vocals between L and R channels - R comes in first.

First appeared on DCC Compact Classics' Toga Rock II (1989, stereo, 2:59)

There's a different analog transfer of this mix on Time-Life's Sounds Of The Seventies Vol. 13 1972 Take Two (1991), where it runs a second or two shorter than Toga Rock 2. The same analog transfer is also used on:

Mystic Music/Warner Special Products' 2-CD Good Times (1991) - a little bit of fuzz on the fade, and absolute polarity inverted (insignificant)
Sony's Wham Bam Thank You Glam (1994) - absolute polarity inverted (insignificant)
Starland Music/Warner Special Products' 2-CD 40 Party Classics (1996)
Madacy's Rock On 1972 (1996) - digitally exactly 1.5 dB louder than Good Times

Have A Nice Day mix

The vocals and the claps in the clap track are panned completely to the right channel.

First appeared on Rhino's Have A Nice Day Vol. 9 (1990, stereo, 2:55)

The same analog transfer is used on:

Razor & Tie's 2-CD Those Rocking '70s (1991)
Rhino's More Stadium Rock (1996)

Greatest Hits mix

Relatively dry mix, which sounds like it has essentially no reverb on anything, especially when compared with the Toga Rock mix. The vocals have a lot less processing. Earlier in the thread, we determined that this is the LP mix.

First appeared on Rhino's Rock And Roll Gary Glitter's Greatest Hits (1991, stereo, 3:01)

The same analog transfer is used on:

Time-Life's Guitar Rock Vol. 5 1972-1973 (1994) - digitally exactly 0.6 dB quieter
Rhino's Rock Instrumental Classics Vol. 3 The '70s (1994)

US 45 mix

The US 45 on Bell 45237 is in mono and runs 3:10. Seek out a needledrop of the US 45, because it doesn't appear on CD. The Toga Rock mix is closest to the US 45 mix, but it's not the same.

UK 45 mix

KentT reported that the UK 45 is a dedicated mono mix. He reported that it sounds great, so I doubt that it matches the US 45. (Ha.)

Edited by crapfromthepast on 16 April 2018 at 8:28pm

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