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edtop40
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| Posted: 25 December 2021 at 1:23pm | IP Logged
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anyone know how billboard calculates its christmas songs on
the hot 100....for example, if someone else does "last
christmas' say, carrie underwood, does that count as a
unique play by carrie underwood or does it get counted as
by wham!?....just wondering..
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edtop40
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Paul Haney
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| Posted: 25 December 2021 at 2:13pm | IP Logged
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edtop40 wrote:
anyone know how billboard calculates its
christmas songs on
the hot 100....for example, if someone else does "last
christmas' say, carrie underwood, does that count as a
unique play by carrie underwood or does it get counted as
by wham!?....just wondering.. |
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Versions of the same songs by different artists are
counted separately.
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PopArchivist
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edtop40 wrote:
anyone know how billboard calculates its christmas songs on
the hot 100....for example, if someone else does "last
christmas' say, carrie underwood, does that count as a
unique play by carrie underwood or does it get counted as
by wham!?....just wondering.. |
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These days Ed, they just chart. Usually for five weeks from the first week of December to the first week of January and whatever the main artist is. So if it's Mariah Carey it would be All I Want For Christmas Is You. If there is a remake under another artist, it would be under their name.
Thats why I end my year at the end of November. While I understand the Hot 100 should reflect Christmas songs, I agree with Brian W that actual charted songs should not miss the top 10 or #1 because of Billboard's policy to let Xmas hits chart for 5 weeks.
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"I'm a pop archivist, not a chart philosopher, I seek to listen, observe and document the chart position of music."
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Hykker
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PopArchivist wrote:
Thats why I end my year at the end of November. While I understand the Hot 100 should reflect Christmas
songs, I agree with Brian W that actual charted songs should not miss the top 10 or #1 because of Billboard's policy to let Xmas
hits chart for 5 weeks. |
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Not that anyone asked me, but to me allowing non-current-release Christmas songs to chart is BS. Makes a mess of the year-end
rankings when a 40 year old song could get enough plays in one month to "count" as one of the top hits of the year.
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Santi Paradoa
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FYI, currently there are two Christmas songs missing
entries in the online database. The CD they appear on is
already listed, but these two songs are not listed under
it. The soundtrack CD Friday After Next (Hollywood 62378)
includes both Donny Hathaway's "This Christmas" and Eartha
Kitt's "Santa Baby" which have both recently charted
decades after they were first released.
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Santi Paradoa
Miami, Florida
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EdisonLite
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Hykker wrote:
Not that anyone asked me, but to me allowing non-current-release
Christmas songs to chart is BS. Makes a mess of the year-end
rankings when a 40 year old song could get enough plays in one month to
"count" as one of the top hits of the year.
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I agree! According to Billboard, one of the top 100 artists of the year (in '22
or '21) was Andy Williams!
By no metrics should he have been considered one of the top 100 artists of
the year (no offense to Andy Williams, and I actually like some of his stuff).
But unless someone specifically looked at Billboard's weekly charts and saw
"It's the Most Wonderful Time of the Year" in Billboard's top 10 portion of
the Hot 100, most people would ask, "Did Andy Williams have a comeback I
missed???"
Also, this past season, besides Christmas songs, there were weeks when
Taylor Swift and other artists released albums that had 15-17 songs chart.
As a result, Jax's "Victoria's Secret" had a #35 peak on the Hot 100, right
before about 6 weeks of all the "craziness" happening. Yet, it peaked at #8
on the all-genre radio charts, about that high on Pop Radio / Mainstream
chart, #1 or #2 Hot AC, #15 AC - so I feel it got slighted for its hot 100 peak
of #35. If it weren't for the Christmas songs, and weekly debuts of album
cuts by superstar acts, I believe this would have gotten much higher. And
then having reached higher #s (like, say, top 20), it could have even led to
more radio stations playing it more (from seeing how well it was doing on
the Hot 100) and it becoming an even bigger hit.
Edited by EdisonLite on 11 March 2023 at 4:17pm
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EdisonLite
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Speaking of Christmas songs on Billboard's Hot 100, a friend and I recently
noted that there was only about 1 Top 40-charting Christmas song in the '70s
(Please Come Home for Christmas by the Eagles) and 1 Top40-charting
Christmas song in the '80s (Band-Aid's Do They Know It's Christmas). I might
be forgetting a few. But basically - Christmas songs weren't allowed to chart in
those 2 decades, so how did these 2 manage to slip through the rules? I guess
the Band-Aid one could be argued that it was a charity single. But the Eagles..
well, they were superstars by then but that's not a reason to make an
exception for that one 45. Surely, Lennon's "Happy Xmas" would have charted
high, and Elton's "Step Into Christmas" would have made top 40 or 100. Has
anyone read why these 2 songs slipped through the cracks, so to speak?
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davidlg1971
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| Posted: 11 March 2023 at 4:55pm | IP Logged
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EdisonLite wrote:
Speaking of Christmas songs on Billboard's Hot 100, a friend and I recently
noted that there was only about 1 Top 40-charting Christmas song in the '70s
(Please Come Home for Christmas by the Eagles) and 1 Top40-charting
Christmas song in the '80s (Band-Aid's Do They Know It's Christmas). I might
be forgetting a few. |
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Two 70s/80s Christmas songs that always spring to mind for me are Paul McCartney's 'Wonderful Christmastime', which hit #28 on the Top 40 in 1979, and Wham! with 'Last Christmas', which hit #4 in 1984/5. It was also #2 for like 10+ weeks straight in the UK, behind 'Do They Know It's Christmas?'.
Edited by davidlg1971 on 11 March 2023 at 4:56pm
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EdisonLite
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Yes, but those are not US peaks in 1979 or 1984.
Those 2 songs didn't chart in Billboard until the past few years.
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Paul Haney
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| Posted: 12 March 2023 at 5:48am | IP Logged
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From 1963 thru 1973, and from 1983 thru 1985, Billboard published a separate Christmas Singles chart and did not
chart Christmas singles on the Hot 100. Yes, the Band Aid song was considered an exception. Remember, this was an
era before the all Christmas music stations started popping up. Starting around Thanksgiving, Top 40 stations would
slowly start sprinkling in some Christmas music, gradually increasing the frequency as Christmas got closer. It's my
guess that Billboard didn't like the fact that a few songs (such as White Christmas) would come back every year for a
few weeks on the Hot 100, thus the change in policy in 1963. There were a smattering of Christmas singles to make
the Hot 100 from 1974-82, with the Eagles song being the most popular, by far.
Frankly, I'd like to see Billboard allow only brand new Christmas songs to make the Hot 100 and for the older ones to
be accounted for on the Holiday 100 chart only. After all, I think most people consider them to be "re-currents" and
no one would confuse Andy Williams, Perry Como and the like to be "hot" artists.
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AndrewChouffi
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People tend to forget that Billboard, at that time, was a
newspaper for the Record and Radio industries. It was not
targeted for the consumer (note the out-of-whack
subscription price & lack of availability on most
magazine racks).
Most likely the reason why the Eagles hit the Hot 100 was
the Eagles' management (possibly Irving Azoff) wanted it
to be treated as a "regular" release (it came out right
in between the 'Hotel California' and 'The Long Run'
eras).
Influential people in the industries could conceivably
contact Billboard in advance of the record's release and
discuss the action plan.
Oftentimes great Christmas singles such as "Step Into
Christmas" were issued when there were contemporaneous
"regular" singles being worked and albums active in the
marketplace.
Andy
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Hykker
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Paul Haney wrote:
Frankly, I'd like to see Billboard allow only brand new Christmas songs to make the Hot 100 and for the older ones to
be accounted for on the Holiday 100 chart only. After all, I think most people consider them to be "re-currents" and
no one would confuse Andy Williams, Perry Como and the like to be "hot" artists. |
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AndrewChouffi wrote:
Most likely the reason why the Eagles hit the Hot 100 was
the Eagles' management (possibly Irving Azoff) wanted it
to be treated as a "regular" release (it came out right
in between the 'Hotel California' and 'The Long Run'
eras).
Oftentimes great Christmas singles such as "Step Into
Christmas" were issued when there were contemporaneous
"regular" singles being worked and albums active in the
marketplace.Andy |
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Both of you make good points. It never occurred to me that the Eagles' management could have somehow convinced BB to treat their Christmas song
differently. I'm a bit surprised that John Lennon's management didn't think of that in 1971, especially given that in the early 70s a solo
release by a Beatle was a big event.
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AndrewChouffi
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| Posted: 13 March 2023 at 7:11am | IP Logged
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Hykker wrote:
Both of you make good points. It never
occurred to me that the Eagles' management could have
somehow convinced BB to treat their Christmas song
differently. I'm a bit surprised that John Lennon's
management didn't think of that in 1971, especially given
that in the early 70s a solo release by a Beatle was a
big event. |
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Well, the 'Imagine' LP was then-currently top 10 on the
Billboard LP chart and maybe they were thinking of
pulling a second 45 off of it (which I don't think
ultimately happened). Conjecture on my part.
And between 1963 and 1972 Billboard published their
special Christmas chart, apparently not allowing
Christmas-themed singles to chart on the Hot 100.
Andy
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Paul Haney
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| Posted: 14 March 2023 at 3:31am | IP Logged
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As I posted earlier, Billboard didn't allow Christmas singles on the Hot 100 from 1962-73, but
other trades did. For example, "Step Into Christmas" by Elton John peaked at #56 in Cash Box
and at #90 in Record World. The Lennon single did even better in 1971, when it peaked at #28 in
Record World and at #36 in Cash Box.
IMO, there were no "shenanigans" with the Eagles single in 1978. It was a legit Top 40 hit
across all 3 major trades at the time. It was a combo of a popular band with a solid performance
of a classic tune. I heard it and the flip side ("Funky New Year") plenty on the radio at the time.
Edited by Paul Haney on 14 March 2023 at 3:34am
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AndrewChouffi
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| Posted: 14 March 2023 at 4:33am | IP Logged
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Paul Haney wrote:
IMO, there were no "shenanigans" with
the Eagles single in 1978. It was a legit Top 40 hit
across all 3 major trades at the time. It was a combo of
a popular band with a solid performance
of a classic tune. I heard it and the flip side ("Funky
New Year") plenty on the radio at the time. |
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Yes, no dispute it was a very legitimate hit at that
time; I heard it on Pop, AC and Rock (album) formats in
regular rotation that season. And it always received
seasonal airplay every year thereafter!
Andy
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Topic: christmas songs on the hot 100
