https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/ Copyright (c) 2006-2013 Web Wiz Forums - All Rights Reserved. Fri, 10 Apr 2026 23:08:35 +0000 Sat, 07 Nov 2020 14:02:57 +0000 http://blogs.law.harvard.edu/tech/rss Web Wiz Forums 12.07 360 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/RSS_post_feed.asp?TID=506 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum//images/Top-40-Music-on-CD-Forum-Logo.png https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/ https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=56396&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#56396 Author: garye
Subject: 506
Posted: 07 November 2020 at 2:02pm

Very wide range of thoughts on this topic.
Being in my 60's, I grew up with Top 40 radio in my
blood. Lived outside of New York in the 60's so WABC
was my teacher, so to speak.
When we moved to Ohio the local Top 40 stations WCOL
and WNCI-FM furthered that education.
I have been one who for the most part would consider
the single as the version of a song most would be
familiar with. At least most of my friends from those
days would say.
Example: Closer To Home (I'm Your Captain) from Grand
Funk Railroad 1970. To me 10 minutes of that song is a
bit much even today. Back then rambling on and on in a
song was what bands had to do to be hip.
Usually with the exception of some rare cases, a waste
of vinyl.
Of course, some longer songs do work better than even
the single of that song, Light My Fire from the Doors
being a case in point.
So if the label tightens up a song to garner airplay
and bring revenue to the band and label, it can be a
win win.
Thoughts from a single edit collector!]]> Sat, 07 Nov 2020 14:02:57 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=56396&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#56396 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=56390&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#56390 Author: PopArchivist
Subject: 506
Posted: 07 November 2020 at 12:40am

budaniel wrote: Hey all. Just curious. Why are so many determined to recreate single edits of songs?

Because those edits encompass the versions on the radio we all knew and grew up with. The LP versions don't need recreations most are out there somewhere on CD, and if they are not you can buy a nice vinyl LP and listen.

Sometimes the edited versions make a song. I know for me Peter Gabriel's Sledgehammer at 4:02 is a tight song, compared to the almost 5-6 minute 45 version. For me, the edit wins everytime.

Where you have Layla by Derek and the Dominos, the 7 min version is sacred and the 2-3 min edit is what it is.

You may have asked the question 14 years ago, but the newbies on the board have no idea how bad most of our OCD is concerning single versions, radio edits and 45 commercial versions are...]]> Sat, 07 Nov 2020 00:40:52 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=56390&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#56390 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55220&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55220 Author: AdvprosD
Subject: 506
Posted: 10 August 2020 at 5:51pm

I can't seem to recall if David Craig spent any time on air here as "Smokey Burns." However, the name David Craig sure does sound familiar.

One guy I used to listen to back in the '60s I believe was Mort Crowley on KXOK-AM. I was surprised to find out that one of my classmates in grade school was actually his daughter. Though she almost
never spoke about it much. Later, I was watching a documentary on bands and stations in Chicago, and his name popped up there too. I'm guessing he and the old sports caster "Harry Carey" traded cities.
I ought to see if I can find some info online about him sometime.

The '70s were wild here for top-40 radio. It was a mixed bucket of just about everything pop or country. The big rock station KSHE seemed to cater to more of the Led Zepplin, Black Sabbath etc. Rock
stations didn't seem to have the "Single" in mind when they programmed the day, but they did stick to repetition on a lighter scale than the top-40 stations did.

I still remember a night when a friend and I got bored after work and called into the FM pop station, KSLQ. After talking to the DJ for a while, (This was late at night after we both got off work at
the local Steak n Shake), we got an invite to hang out with the guy on-air. It was a blast to sit in the booth as a teenager and see how stuff was actually done before automation came along. I have
no idea who the DJ was anymore, but it sure was a good way to spend an hour or so watching him work.

One thing that stuck with me from broadcasting school was the voice training. I was told numerous times that I ought to do parties in the late '80s, so I tried it out and was entrenched for two decades!
I also held down a regular 9-5 job at the same time. Times were pretty good for a guy who moonlighted as a Mobile DJ here. Also, I expanded my knowledge of music and genre while doing it. I hope to
read a number of stories here of folks in other cities who did likewise.]]> Mon, 10 Aug 2020 17:51:17 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55220&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55220 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55219&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55219 Author: aaronk
Subject: 506
Posted: 10 August 2020 at 5:35pm

AdvprosD wrote: I wonder, does the mod allow a single thread to have us describe ourselves? It sure would be cool to hear a number of stories about all the in and ex-radio folks that still hang out just for the fun of it. Of course, I also know there are some who like to keep all the radio and production stuff private too.

Pat and I are the only mods, and I’m fine with that. I haven’t asked Pat,
but I feel he would be okay with it, too. We are all excellent about
staying on topic, so one thread that doesn’t talk about top 40 music on
CD is not an issue IMO. ]]> Mon, 10 Aug 2020 17:35:54 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55219&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55219 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55217&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55217 Author: dacs2000
Subject: 506
Posted: 10 August 2020 at 5:22pm

Wow! this thread is really up my alley, as I'm almost
finished compiling a complete digitisation of
Australia's entire Ktel Compilation run from 1974 to
2000.

This subject wasn't really relavent as for being a kid
in the late 70s and 80s, I would just tape much of the
stuff off radio, Sydney getting it's first FM stations
in April 1980, this was a real thrill.

But as much as I used my father's hi fi cassette deck
in combination with TDK AD and Maxell UD tapes to get
the best results, it kind of lacked something, and
just when I started buying my own music, CD came out,
so I was kind of straight into CD from the get go.

Finishing school and my part time jobs here and there,
I started earning better dollars and with that in 1988
and 1989 started buying many more CDs, and the very
first thing that really punched me in the stomach
harder then a kick up the behind was Paul Youngs "No
Parlez" CD; completely different from the record.
"Come back and Stay" was unrecognisable, "Love of the
common people" was stretched to insanity, and
"wherever I lay my hat" was just going on, and on, and
on, and on, and on, you get the idea. The next one
shortly after was Dead or Alive's "Youthquake".
"Lover come back" and "you spin me round" sounded
fine, but "In to deep" was what the hell? Whatever
happened to that big huge Synth intro, instead was
just a solo rhythm guitar, this album version really
really sucked.

1990 I started getting into community radio, and it
was at this time that the ducks started aligning, the
people at the record store I regularly visited, HMV
Mid CIty, started appreciating that I was a regular
customer, and gave me a few perks. One of which was
being able to return and swap CDs without the hassle
if I didn't have the docket. I guess some would have
used this opportunity to buy CDs, record them to a
good tape, and return the CD back, but this wasn't my
intention at all.

CDs were still very expensive back then, and it was
often a purchase of AU$25 to $30 for a disc, for
getting one or two songs. If these were the wrong
versions, I felt that I was shafted, and luckily with
this they were many albums I had to return and swap,
just because they DID NOT have the correct single
version.    

At the same time, they were suddenly an abundance of
greatest hits and best of compilations appearing under
budget labels, and 1990 and 1991 were the two years
that saw not just a huge boost to my CD collection,
but finally starting to get many correct single
versions and edits.

For the next several years I worked at various
community stations in Western Sydney, and then from
the late 90s established my own internet radio
station, hoping to get broadcast spectrum. With the
rise of automated playout systems and computers, I
digitised my entire CD collection. By 2010 I had
around 16,000 tracks, and it was at this point that
the penny dropped that compiling the entire Australian
Ktel series was a serious possibility.

In 2012 I researched some australian websites, and
eventually discogs and with the relavent info,
compiled quite a few hundred ktel comps. They were
still several tracks missing. This is where second
hand record fares, torrents, lossless streaming hosts
like deezer and tidal, and a few UK digital flac
stores came in very handy. One DJ service I would like
to recommend on this board, but don't know if it's
outside of the rules, specialised in hosting WAVs of
every UK charting hit from the 50s onwards.

But with me, I am a singles version maniac, but as my
era of music is the 70s, 80s, and 90s, the length of
an average single was around 3:30 to about 4:45, and
this is really the absolute attention span of me
enjoying a song, album versions do make me sleepy, as
I actually do drift off.

THey are a few album versions that do stand out as
being great:

Billy Ocean - When the going gets tough
Michael Jacksons - Thriller
Far Corporation - Stairway to heaven
Jon Bon Jovi - Blaze of glory
Elton John's - Chloe (full ten minute version)
Abba - Summer night city
Roxette - It mut have been love

But again, these are few and far between and with this
most importantly the one thing that was often
understated was that single edits had over dubs, extra
instruments, slightly different configurations in the
instrument mix that just made them sound more
appealing. I don't know about others on here, but
aside from finding the right single edit, I'm also
trying to find such versions without them being
dynamically smashed to pieces - many record labels
today seem to be hell bent on destroying every piece
of head room and nuance that's contained within a
track.

]]> Mon, 10 Aug 2020 17:22:11 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55217&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55217 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55215&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55215 Author: eriejwg
Subject: 506
Posted: 10 August 2020 at 3:16pm

Yes, there are differences between the 45 and Lp versions
of Brandy as well. The CD's that contain the 45 version
are documented in the database.

There was a radio DJ that worked here in the 1970s, later
leaving for Philadelphia, Birmingham and some other cities
eventually ending up in St. Louis. Not sure if you ever
worked with him but his name is David Craig on-air, real
last name is Lankford. His air name here in Erie, PA in
the 1970s was "Smokey Burns."]]> Mon, 10 Aug 2020 15:16:20 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55215&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55215 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55214&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55214 Author: AdvprosD
Subject: 506
Posted: 10 August 2020 at 2:49pm

Hey John!

Thanks for dropping in and giving me that mini-bio of how you got here. I find all that kind of stuff fascinating! I wonder, does the mod allow a single thread to have us describe ourselves?
It sure would be cool to hear a number of stories about all the in and ex-radio folks that still hang out just for the fun of it. Of course, I also know there are some who like to keep all the
radio and production stuff private too.

I never did actually make it on-air. Though I had a year and a half at the STLMO based "Broadcast Center." It was kind of like a trade school for on-air wanna bees. It also had a valuable format
of having local radio and TV folks to mind the students along with a fair amount of self study. I had plans to jump directly into the metropolitan market to bypass all the small station startups,
which wasn't really a smart way to start. I think the original guy who started the school was Gephardt. Later, his son I believe carried on the management. Geez! was that really forty years ago?

I did however meet a lot of folks in the industry. All with stories of stations and music. I guess that was plenty of value to me right there as it was.

There's a lot more to those stories but, I guess I have to jab about a single here to keep this post legit!

I have to re-check but, I think there is also another one that I sometimes hear in single form by the band Looking Glass. "Brandy You're a Fine Girl" has some instrument differences between single
and album versions too, if I'm not mistaken. I'll have to go figure it out or, more than likely it's been covered in an old thread.

I'm glad to have found this forum!

]]> Mon, 10 Aug 2020 14:49:49 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55214&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55214 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55209&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55209 Author: eriejwg
Subject: 506
Posted: 10 August 2020 at 10:03am

Welcome aboard, Dave! I, like a few here over the years,
began a career in radio. I started in my teens and
remained in the radio business until 1997 (23 years.)
While in the radio business, I also began to mobile DJ.
First, in many bars and clubs, then moving into weddings
in the mid-1990s. I began subscribing to music services
for DJs, first with Hot Hits, then Top Hits USA, then
PrimeCuts, and now Promo Only. I always was aware of
radio edits and single versions (or 45 versions), but it
didn't really hit me until around 2007 when I realized
client music requests of older songs I was getting were
way longer than they would have been when released. Case
in point, Tupelo Honey from Van Morrison.

I then did a Google search to figure out differences in
lengths and versions. I came across a site with an
article including information from a James Abbott, who I
discovered through further links was a regular
contributor to this site. This led me to become a
subscriber to Pat Downey's online database and following
the posts. This led to a huge light bulb going off in my
head that my perception was correct. There were
differences. That led me to start asking questions,
buying a turntable after many years and dubbing 45s and
recreating single edits.

Jim Abbott has since passed away but had I not found
that article where Jim described the differences between
several songs, some DJ short edits etc., I would not
have parked myself here for the last 13 years and
counting!

In reference to "Joy To The World" from Three Dog Night,
the 45 version has made it to CD but fades a few seconds
early to hide vinyl noise. It really is the superior
version vs. the LP version.

Enjoy your stay, I'm sure you'll become as addicted
about finding the 45 version and DJ edits much like I
have. And, I'm still DJing at weddings and events,
though this year has really proved challenging at best.]]> Mon, 10 Aug 2020 10:03:48 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55209&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55209 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55198&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55198 Author: AdvprosD
Subject: 506
Posted: 09 August 2020 at 9:01pm

Did anyone comment on the details of the Three Dog Night, "Joy To The World?" I have to admit I only skimmed this thread.

What I remember about this song was that there was certainly a radio version that had a sweet guitar solo in the bridge that other versions didn't have.

I also had a more album oriented approach to collecting until I started doing DJ work. At that point, it was clear that folks didn't want to hear the album
cuts at parties as often as the single, or radio 45 versions. The 45 versions often were brighter and easier to keep a dancing group's attention with. So
I had to start re-collecting songs I already had.

Somewhere, I posted a comment about Chuck Mangione and the song, "Feels So Good." Though I'd never play it except maybe for a dinner selection, I still prefer
the whole album cut. Same with Inna-Gadda-Da-Vida. (To me), some songs just shouldn't have had a 45 version. If you were there you knew those songs in long play
because many FM stations were happy to play whole album sides. I had to put "To me" in parentheses, obviously others won't agree with that comment.

When "Oxygene" made it's debut on STL radio, I was there and waiting for the complete album experience. Later, "Part IV" became a hit from the album. I have no
idea if there was an actual 45 version or not. I'm sure I could go to the books and check that one.]]> Sun, 09 Aug 2020 21:01:13 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=55198&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#55198 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=3952&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#3952 Author: Grant
Subject: 506
Posted: 10 March 2006 at 8:47pm

budaniel wrote: I think the styles of music we're talking about here are what lend themselves to our tastes in song lengths. 80smusicfreak and myself didn't grow up in the golden age of the single...we grew up in the golden age of the MAXI single. While I totally agree that the long version of In Gada is something I don't want to sit through (but still want to own along with the 7" version for completist's sake), when i hear, let's say, "We Are Family" by Sister Sledge, or any of the Donna Summer/Giorgio Moroder synth masterpieces, I want to hear those full length album versions, because the songs just start getting good at the point where the single fades out! As 80s dance music took over 9and even "rock" music was dance music at that point), the "extended remix" was pretty much planned from the start and was usually the better version...For instance, I listen to any Dead or Alive album version, and I feel totally cheated because there is so much more going on in the extended remixes--the singles are actually all out boring to me. Songs of the 50s and 60s, most often, just don't lend themselves to extended or long versions--although, I still get all giddy when I look in the database under, say, The Supremes, and see "15 second longer fade than any previously released version." The thought of hearing 15 more seconds of ad-libbed fade by Diana and the girls never heard before--- AWESOME.

   I love soul and funk music of the late 70s and early 80s, so i'm in there with you!

I am in my 40s and started collecting records in 1968, at the age of five! I listen to all kinds of music, so I am well-rounded. But, it was usually the singles for me. Whe I started buying albums in 1973, I still bought many more 45s. More music that way. In many cases, I like and have both or all versions.

About "We Are Family", I had the 45 first. Then a year later I got the LP. I apreciate both versions for what they are, and listen to both. But, I prefer the version of the Rhino-Atlantic CD because it is at the slower, recorded speed.

Even in the late 70s, there were many times major differences between singles and LPs. Some people may not care to much about differences, but I do, right down to the fade! I once went through several CDs looking for the full-length version of "Everybody Plays The Fool" by the Main Ingredient. I finally found it. lol! I also keep the Billboard Top Hits 1975 around because it is the only CD I have that contains the full-length version of Elton John's "Philadelphia Freedom". If you have any EJ comps, you just don't have it. They all fade the song too early. All the more reason to seek out single versions. Sometimes they are longer than the album versions. More music to gear! Right?]]> Fri, 10 Mar 2006 20:47:33 +0000 https://top40musiconcd.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=506&PID=3952&title=wondering-why-an-obsession-about#3952