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Quicksand - Martha & Vandellas
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Pat Downey View Drop Down
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Points: 1 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pat Downey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Quicksand - Martha & Vandellas
    Posted: 03 January 2009 at 3:25pm
Several weeks ago when Jim and I were exchanging emails regarding Martha & The Vandellas single "Quicksand" as it appears on the Complete Motown Singles, I noticed that there was something fishy in Detroit. There are two versions of Quicksand appearing on the Complete Motown Singles and they are titled version 1 and version 2 and both versions begin with a bass drum beat. Jim sent me a copy of his original vinyl 45 of Quicksand and lo and behold there is no opening bass drum beat on his single which he swears is an original domestic pressing of this song. So did Harry Weinger screw up by not placing all vinyl pressings of Quicksand on the Complete Motown Singles or what????
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Yah Shure View Drop Down
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Points: 0 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Yah Shure Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 January 2009 at 1:28pm
Apparently so, Pat. My original commercial 45 (pressed by RCA) is just like Jim's, with no opening bass drum beat.
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Pat Downey View Drop Down
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Points: 1 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pat Downey Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 January 2009 at 6:47pm
Does anyone have an original 45 of Quicksand that does start with a bass drum beat?
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JMD1961 View Drop Down
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Points: 2 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JMD1961 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 June 2010 at 3:18pm
Not an answer to the question of this thread, but I thought I'd point out that my copy of Time-Life's "Classic Rock - 1964: Shakin' All Over" contains this track, but it's not noted in the DB.
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Points: 0 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote KentT Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 July 2010 at 7:55pm
First pressings of this track have no opening bass drum beat. Second pressings forward have the bass drum beat. All first pressings I have seen have emanated from RCA Victor's Indianapolis, Indiana plant. Second pressings onward I have seen are all ARP (American Record Pressing) made in Owosso, Michigan. Our UK Tamla-Motown EMI pressing is the second version and sounds the best of our 5 different pressings we own. We also have a Canadian pressing which is superb.
I turn up the good and turn down the bad!
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Points: 0 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TomDiehl1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 July 2010 at 3:58pm
My copy of the 45 is a styrene pressing and is missing the opening drumbeat.
Live in stereo.
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edtop40 View Drop Down
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Points: 2 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote edtop40 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 May 2013 at 12:32pm
my commercial 45 issued as gordy 7025 contains the drum
intro.....the run out groove etching is 'PK4M-5343-2A'
edtop40
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davidclark View Drop Down
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Points: 9 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote davidclark Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 October 2021 at 4:58am
There's much confusion with this one. For anyone who can sort out the
mess, here are my findings:

Mono versions:

1) A version without an opening drumbeat (I found two 45s like this on
YouTube). The vocal starts at 0:23 with "Quicksand". Runs 2:36. This is on
"The Ultimate Collection". From above, seems to be the "common" 45
version (if we can assign such a title to one).

The two versions on The Complete Motown Singles Vol. 3: 1963:

2) The longer one, marked "(first pressing)" opens with a "clean" drumbeat.
Vocal starts at 0:29 with "Quicksand". Runs 2:45.

3) The second version, marked "second pressing" also starts with a
drumbeat, but not the same as the other "clean" drumbeat. There's a bit of
"echoey vocal" over the drum. Vocal starts at 0:23 with "Like Quicksand".
Runs 2:36. I question the authenticity of this one (perhaps mono 1966
"Greatest Hits"?)

Stereo versions (all with clean drumbeat):

4) One marked "LP version". Vocal starts at 0:23 with "Like Quicksand".
Runs 2:33. I can't seem to find a parent LP for this - it was not on on "Heat
Wave". Seems this version was first issued on stereo May 1966 LP
"Greatest Hits".

5) The May 1966 "A Collection Of 16 Original Big Hits, Volume 3" version.
Vocal starts at 0:29 with "Like Quicksand". Runs 2:42.

Strange that the above two versions differ, yet both stereo LPs were issued
May 1966.

6) "The Motown Box" version, marked "remixed 45 version". Vocal starts at
0:24 with "Quicksand". Runs 2:45. This does not match any of the above
versions.

So, looking at the mono issues, what's up? I would go with 1) being legit,
but I'm not sure about 2) and 3). I would like to confirm if the "other (1st)
45" is indeed 2) above.

Then there's the vocal start time, the "Quicksand" vs. "Like Quicksand"
vocal, the opening drumbeat and timing differences...what a mess!

Can anyone offer up any other "original" 45s for this? Or knowledge? I
believe it's a challenge! edtop40 and KentT, can you offer more specifics on
your 45s?

Edited by davidclark
dc1
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mjb50 View Drop Down
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Points: 18 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mjb50 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 3:30am
I started to try to figure out which versions are from where & when, but ran out of time. So for the benefit of Ron or whoever wants to continue the research…

Some differences to listen for:
• mono or stereo?
• opening drum beat present?
• opening beat includes echo tail of what sounds like the "4" from a count-off?
• vocal harmonies abruptly cut off by horn stabs at 0:11?
• 4 bars of instrumental or 6 before lyrics start?
• sax around 0:18 is mostly staccato (halting), or partially legato (notes join together)?
• lyrics begin with "Like quicksand" or just "Quicksand"?
• heavy reverb on drum break near end?

Edited by mjb50 - Yesterday at 3:37am
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Todd Ireland View Drop Down
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Points: 14 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Todd Ireland Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Yesterday at 3:49am
Originally posted by davidclark davidclark wrote:

There's much confusion with this one. For anyone who can sort out the

mess, here are my findings:



Mono versions:



1) A version without an opening drumbeat (I found two 45s like this on

YouTube). The vocal starts at 0:23 with "Quicksand". Runs 2:36. This is on

"The Ultimate Collection". From above, seems to be the "common" 45

version (if we can assign such a title to one).



The two versions on The Complete Motown Singles Vol. 3: 1963:



2) The longer one, marked "(first pressing)" opens with a "clean" drumbeat.

Vocal starts at 0:29 with "Quicksand". Runs 2:45.



3) The second version, marked "second pressing" also starts with a

drumbeat, but not the same as the other "clean" drumbeat. There's a bit of

"echoey vocal" over the drum. Vocal starts at 0:23 with "Like Quicksand".

Runs 2:36. I question the authenticity of this one (perhaps mono 1966

"Greatest Hits"?)



Hmmm... If the latter two tracks appeared on The Complete Motown Singles Vol. 3: 1963, then this would strongly suggest that they were most likely issued on some commercial 45 pressings, given how those box set compilations were meticulously dedicated and devoted to Motown's singles output, right? Or is anyone aware of any examples of tracks appearing on the Complete Motown Singles series that never actually saw the light of day on a 45 pressing? (Paging Brian W! If anyone would know the answer to this question, it's probably him!)

Edited by Todd Ireland - Yesterday at 3:55am
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