donnie iris "love is like a rock"

Todd - I did the same comparison, and I conclude that's it's a different mix.

The mix on the 20th Century Masters CD is drier overall. The drums are a little punchier, and are pushed forward in the mix. Basically, everything sounds bigger and better defined. In comparison, the mix on King Cool sounds pretty sloppy.

If you need to latch onto one element to find a difference, try the line "never stop you" starting at 1:16. In the King Cool mix, there's a prominent guitar lick in the right channel that starts on the word "stop". In the 20th Century Masters mix, it's buried way in the background.

The two mixes sure are close, though. Very much like the 45 mix of Steel Breeze's "You Don't Want Me Anymore", which dialed back the reverb for the 45.

I'm actually really impressed at how fantastic the 20th Century Masters CD version sounds. I got used to the wall of reverb, and it's pretty shocking how great the song sounds once the reverb is peeled back.

(Edit: It seems that the LP and 45 mixes are the same, and that the 20th Century Masters mix is new, so I adjusted the wording of this post to reflect that.)

Edited by crapfromthepast

Oh i clicked in here right away because I meant to ask
this very question ....
I have the song on 2 different comps (i'd have to look
them up) .. and i noticed that one was relatively dry and
the other has a lot of reverb.

A 45/LP difference seemed the most likely explanation.

So i'm gathering that the drier mix is the 45?

Also, i do wonder if the LP had a re-pressing with the 45
mix included..that would explain why some folks don't
hear a difference between the 2.
M

The mastering credit on 20th Century Masters was Doug Schwartz, so I thought I'd find him (thanks, Google!) and ask him about the track.

Here's his reply:

"In all honesty, I can't remember exactly what sources were given to me for that Donnie Iris project. I'm almost certain this was not a special remix, but the question of where that song was sourced may be irretrievable. Typically I'd get a box of tapes from the vault and would evaluate on a case by case basis which would yield the best results. I did a whole slew of those Best of/20th Century Masters with Andy McKaie and the crew at Universal, and often he would have a post-it note on the outside of a reel saying "Song A, Song B" or whatever. It's gratifying to know that the work still sounds good to your ears."

After a back-and-forth or two in which I listed some of my favorite mastering engineers, he offered:

"Before I even began my recording career, I was a nerd with a gatefold jacket on his lap, memorizing LP credits, so I'm right there with ya. I'm lucky enough to be on a first-name basis with several of the luminaries you've mentioned: Steve Hoffman was there at MCA before Andy McKaie (there's a whole story there). Lee Herschberg recorded several of my Mom (and her sisters) for Dot and Coral in the early 60's. I'll always remember meeting Bill Inglot and him saying "Just patch direct out of the tape deck into the converters-we don't need any processing". He really knew his stuff, and that's not even mentioning his encyclopedic knowledge of rock."

"I really do wish I had more complete info to give you. My best guess would be that the vault has several passes at that song. Oftentimes, mixes for single/45 had a narrower stage (if not downright mono) so somehow my bet is that there's a better source than what was used initially for the King Cool release. This brings us back to Inglot, who used to absolutely insist on using the first generation master tape and not an EQ'd for LP copy. Guys at the vault in the dawn of the CD era were not so versed in what the differences were, and how important that could be."

That's directly from mastering engineer Doug Schwartz, who deserves a thank-you from all of us here for being so gracious in his correspondence.

So, we can conclude definitively that it was not remixed from the multi-tracks for 20th Century Masters, but was made earlier and was probably unused.

I should probably try to ask Donnie Iris himself. He may not remember the specifics (from a scant 30 years ago), but at least it will give me an excuse to get in touch with Donnie Iris!

Edited by crapfromthepast

Attn: Pat. The db already lists the following under Donnie Iris' 1981 hit, "Ah! Leah!":

(S)      (3:41)      Seathru 101 Out Of The Blue

As a huge DI fan, I have that CD as well; it's actually a 1992 compilation of most of his '80s hits, plus six then-new songs. However, note that track 12 is "Love is Like a Rock", and I see that Out of the Blue is currently NOT shown under this song in the on-line database. (They did leave off his third top 40 hit, 1982's "My Girl", though.) Both "Ah! Leah!" and "Love is Like a Rock" are the original hit recordings on Out of the Blue, licensed from MCA...

crapfromthepast wrote: The mastering credit on 20th Century Masters was Doug Schwartz, so I thought I'd find him (thanks, Google!) and ask him about the track.

A belated nod to your excellent detective work as always, cftp. I have yet to meet DI or see him in concert myself, but he's been very high on my list for some 15 years now! (Alas, he no longer strays very far from western PA/eastern OH anymore when performing.) I will second Todd's request to please post here, should you ever get in contact w/ him - he does seem fairly accessible, from what I understand...