Cutting Crew - (I Just) Died In Your Arms
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Topic: Cutting Crew - (I Just) Died In Your Arms
Posted By: MMathews
Subject: Cutting Crew - (I Just) Died In Your Arms
Date Posted: 12 September 2006 at 5:07pm
|
Hi All,
I am struggling to recall on this one. I noticed the database lists a 45 length & LP length, but no other difference. I once had the 45 and the CD "Broadcast" but long ago got rid of both. I now only have the UK "Best Of The Cutting Crew". It contains 2 versions of the track. The first version runs 4:38 and fades with the end guitar break. This version seems the same as the version on "Broadcast" LP. The other, I recall being annoyed when i got it home because it's listed as "Extended Remix" - I had hoped it was the elusive promo 12" single version, but in fact it runs 4:45 and is a remix with added/different reverb and runs a few secs more, to the end of the guitar break, and fades on those synth notes that open the song. My question is, didn't the 45 have this remix? I'd swear when I heard it on this CD, the mix was nothing new to me. Perhaps the 45 had the LP mix faded earlier on one side, and this remix on the other? Anyway, thanks in advance to anyone who has these sources and can refresh my memory on this track. -MM |
Replies:
Posted By: cmmmbase
Date Posted: 12 September 2006 at 5:37pm
| The stock copy had the "remix". Can't speak for the promo... |
Posted By: Pat Downey
Date Posted: 12 September 2006 at 8:17pm
| My dj 45 is just an early fade of the LP and runs (4:26) not (4:23) as stated on the record label. Matrix number is STVR-51287-2 QR-17289-2 |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 12 September 2006 at 10:53pm
|
This was brought up in an earlier thread, but not fully investigated. Per the database, the version on Broadcast runs (4:43). I was always under the impression that this was the version that ends with the synth quickly fading out, as MMatthews describes above.
I believe it's one of those cases where two 45 versions exist, because Ed stated in the other thread that his 45 runs (4:43) and ends with the synthesizer. I also have the 45, but mine runs closer to (4:26) and fades out during the guitar solo at the end. I've never done a close comparison to see if there were any mix differences, because none were blatently obvious. Is it possible that some CD pressings of Broadcast contain the (4:43) 45 remix that you guys are talking about? |
Posted By: MMathews
Date Posted: 13 September 2006 at 3:51pm
|
Hi again,
well glad to see I'm not crazy (at least about this one thing...) What started this was I was about to choose which version I was going to rip and for my 80's folder. I chose the "remix" with the synth ending because it was most familiar to me. That led me to check the database to see if I was labeling it "45 version"... I recalled that was the reason i was annoyed that the UK cd called it "extended remix" and I had said what they called "extended" was merely the U.S. 45 version. Oh, and besides the different ending, the other most noticable element (under phones) is the lead vocal has stereo reverb echo-ing in the left-right. The LP mix does not. My thanks to those who are all digging out and checking their singles - and my apologies to Pat if I've now added yet another 45 that had 2 different issues. But I was really sure about this one.... -MM |
Posted By: vanmeter
Date Posted: 13 September 2006 at 4:44pm
| I posted here about this once before, but my 45 without doubt has the synth by itself in a quick fadeout. I was surprised to hear that there was another version! |
Posted By: EdisonLite
Date Posted: 14 September 2006 at 12:01am
| Did either the dj or stock 45s with the 4:23 fade contain the remix version, i.e. the remix with the stereo reverb on the lead vocal, but faded to 4:23? |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 17 September 2006 at 12:47am
My 45 is in Michigan, so unfortunately, I cannot check. Can anyone else help out? Now, I had not paid much attention to the two versions until now, but they are drastically two different mixes. Not only is there added reverb on the vocals, but there are lots of other differences. The guitars are brought forward in the (4:43) remix, and the drums have more punch. I checked three different CDs in my collection, and here are my findings: - Pure 80s Love has the (4:43) remix - Totally 80s (Razor & Tie) has the (4:34) non-remixed faded version - Whole Lotta Rock 1986-1987 has the (4:34) non-remixed faded version I'm very curious to know if those faded 45s are remixed or not. I wish I had mine with me :( |
EdisonLite wrote:Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 17 September 2006 at 4:36am
| Aaron: Both sides of my DJ 45 are (4:23). In the next day or two I was shoot a dub out to you, so you can further investigate with your own ears, and then hopefully get to the bottom of this "mixes" controversy. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 18 September 2006 at 11:02am
| I just listened to a dub of Jim's (4:23) DJ 45, and it has the remixed version but faded during the guitar break. This leads me to believe that my commercial 45 is the same way. I'll try to have my parents dig it up and provide the runout groove info. |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 18 September 2006 at 12:56pm
| Aaron: I also have the stock 45 for it (of course, unless you're overdue to call your folks!) Listed time 4:41; deadwax is "STVR 51238", then a dot and a "1", followed by a crossed out character, which was either an "S" or an "8". My DJ 45 deadwax is not like Pat's earlier DJ info, which was why I went ahead and sent it to Aaron, although that may have appeared redundant to some. My DJ copy deadwax simply has "STVR-51287-1". If you need me to supply you with a dub of my stock 45 to further the research, Aaron, let me know. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 18 September 2006 at 11:55pm
|
Jim, I appreciate all your hard work in solving this case. You've provided some very valuable information. Based on the info so far, it appears there are two different DJ 45s: one with the LP version faded (like what Pat has) and one with the remix faded (like yours).
I'm still going to call my folks (not because it's overdue--haha), but because I'd like to find out what I have. Jim, does your stock 45 fade out during the guitar solo or does it run 4:43? |
Posted By: jimct
Date Posted: 19 September 2006 at 12:35am
| Aaron: My stock 45 does not fade out during the guitar solo, and runs (4:43). |
Posted By: edtop40
Date Posted: 23 October 2006 at 6:42pm
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my commercial 45 runs 4:43 and is identical to the version from "broadcast".....i don't know about any remix....maybe the 4:24 is the remix version but my 45 is the same as the cd version and runs 4:43.......it should be noted that the 4:43 45 version is the same as the full cd/lp version....my 45 has the same inscription in the run out groove as jim's.... ------------- edtop40 |
Posted By: Pat Downey
Date Posted: 25 October 2006 at 9:04pm
| Has anyone found a dj copy that runs (4:43) with either of the mixes? |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 31 October 2006 at 11:46pm
|
I recently obtained a copy of the Power Players compilation, which contains the remixed version that fades out during the guitar solo. The run time is (4:24). This is the first CD I've come across that has the remixed version faded. All my other CDs with the fade have the non-remixed version.
Unfortunately, I still have not asked my parents to dig out my 45, but I am very confident that it's the remixed version faded to (4:23), like Jim's promo 45. Does anyone have a copy of the vinyl LP who can tell us which version it contains? MMatthews says the non-remixed faded version appears on the Broadcast LP, but he does not specify vinyl or CD. I still have a gut feeling that CD copies contain the remixed 45 version that does not fade, and that is why Pat is saying "early fade of the LP version." |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 01 November 2006 at 12:07am
|
By the way, the first place where you can easily tell the remixed from the non-remixed version apart is right after the first chorus when the drums kick in. Between the first and second guitar riff, the non-remixed version has two soft strums of an acoustic guitar (somewhat faint). On the remixed version, these guitar strums are so far back in the mix, they are practically non-existant.
Regarding the vocal reverb that is noted above, the remixed version has more of an echo. Listen for the line "Her diary sits by the bedside table." On the non-remixed version, there is only some faint reverb. On the remixed version, it sounds like "Her diary sits by the bedside table (table)." Also, when comparing the two, the lead vocal is mixed louder on the remixed version. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 06 November 2006 at 12:47am
| Pat, were you planning on distinguishing between the remixed and non-remixed versions on this one? |
Posted By: Pat Downey
Date Posted: 06 November 2006 at 6:53am
| My priority right now is to get the backlog of new cd's off my desk and into the database. Time-Life has been releasing box set after box set with hundreds of songs in each box that take forever to review. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 06 November 2006 at 2:13pm
| I understand. I was just wondering if this thread was pretty much put to rest (other than your question above) or if we needed to do more digging on this one. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 20 February 2007 at 1:25pm
| I had completely forgotten to ask my parents to dig for my 45 copy. I'll make a note to have them pull it out, and we can see if my commercial copy's matrix number matches Jim's promo 45 with the remixed faded version. |
Posted By: crapfromthepast
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 7:01pm
|
I just did a comparison of my 13 CDs that feature this song, including null tests, and I thought I'd post my findings.
Sounds Of The Eighties 1987 (Time-Life R988-09, 1995) is digitally exactly 2 dB louder than Body Talk Once In A Lifetime (Time-Life R834-15, 1997), digitally exactly 2.5 dB louder than Modern Rock 1986-1987 (Time-Life R828-04, 1999) and digitally exactly 3 dB louder than Body Talk Hearts On Fire (Time-Life R834-21, 2000). The mastering on all of the above Time-Life CDs is horrendously maximized/compressed, and should be avoided if possible. Living In Oblivion Vol. 3 (EMI 27674, 1994) is digitally identical to both Mystic Music presents Cool Rock (Cema S22-18168, 1995) and Retro Lunchbox Gooey Love Songs (EMI-Capitol 72438-19718, 1997) and is same version but slightly different EQ as Now That's What I Call Music '86 (Virgin EMI [UK] CD NOW 86, 1986). The NOW and Living In Oblivion CDs can null to about -40 dB, so the EQ is pretty close. The mastering on the EMI discs is quite good, and is not maximized at all. All of the above feature the common version with the fade at about 4:35. Rock Of The 80's Vol. 3 (Priority 53704, 1992) is horrendously maximized/compressed, like the Time-Life CDs. Same 4:35 fade. Totally '80s (Razor & Tie/Warner Special Products OPCD-4544, 1993) is mastered by Steve Hoffman, and is the best-sounding version in existence. Same 4:35 fade. Now 1986 (Virgin EMI [UK] 27068, 1993) is mastered fairly well, but has a slightly shorter fade at around 4:23. Most of the tracks on the 1993 Now collections have truncated fades, in order to fit 20 tracks per CD. Greatest Hits Of The 80's (Disky [Europe] 8-CD set 853222, 1998) is mastered fairly well and has the same 4:35 fade. The "A" List (Swaitek, 1994) has the cold synth ending at 4:44. I think this is the remix version (see post below), while all the others are the non-remix. (I apologize if this info isn't all that useful, but I felt the urge to post it somewhere, so that it wouldn't be lost to history.) |
Posted By: crapfromthepast
Date Posted: 22 May 2007 at 7:47pm
|
I dug out my 45, and I have the promo 45 with a sleeve. Odd, but that's what showed up at my college radio station at the time, and since we didn't play 45s on the air - yoink!
The credits on the 45 label say 4:23 (the true time is somewhere between 4:23 and 4:25), the deadwax says "SVTR-51287-1", the printed matrix number on the label is ST-VR-51287-SP, and the label clearly says "Remixed by Shelly Yakus". To my ears, I had difficulty picking out the remix/non-remix versions unless I had them side-by-side. I couldn't hear the reverb on the vocals described in the above posts. I did notice that the remix version is quite a bit louder in the soft passage around 3:30 than the non-remix version. And the snare sound in the remix is a bit more boomy and a little less defined than in the non-remix. When you have the remix and non-remix files side-by-side on an editing program, you'll see that the remix fades ever-so-slightly faster than the non-remix, but you probably won't hear the difference. I think one way to tell them apart is that the remix is a tiny bit faster (125.1 BPM) than the non-remix version (124.9 BPM on all my CDs except The "A" List), which leads me to think that my version on The "A" List (see above post) is the remix with the cold synth ending. Now I mentioned that my promo 45 came with a sleeve. The sleeve is apparently for the commercial 45, because my promo 45 is the same on both A- and B-sides, and there's a B-side listed on the sleeve. The sleeve front has a large Cutting Crew, with a dotted line separating the top color scheme (green/gold) from the bottom (grey/white). The back of the sleeve has text that gives credits for both A- and B-sides. The time given for the A-side is 4:41, and it clearly reads "REMIXED BY: shelly yakus (i just) died in your arms". If the sleeve is correct, then at least one pressing of the commercial 45 should have the remix with a length of 4:41, which should be the cold synth ending. That version turns up on The "A" List, and I would think it would turn up on the TM Century discs as well, since the two collections are pretty similar. Anyone else have a sleeve? |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 23 May 2007 at 12:29am
|
Mine has a sleeve, but again, it's in Michigan. Every time I call my parents, I forget to ask about it :( Sorry! Although I don't have hard evidence to prove it, my theory is as follows:
- 4:35 faded version is the original LP version - 4:25 faded version is the remixed, shorter 45 version (also on DJ 45s) - 4:44 cold ending version is the remixed, longer 45 version (included on some/most/all CD pressings of the "Broadcast" album) Again, this is only my speculation, but I'm still not convinced that Pat's DJ 45 is different from Jim's, other than the matrix number. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 05 November 2007 at 9:41am
| I have my 45 copy in my possession. I will have access to a turntable shortly, but in the meantime, my deadwax info is STVR 51238-25 Q R-17222-2 Precision (delta)15480 1-1. My copy also says "Remixed by Shelly Yakus" and has a printed time of 4:41. |
Posted By: eriejwg
Date Posted: 05 November 2007 at 10:32am
| My copy from the import Now: 1986 runs 4:29. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 05 November 2007 at 10:34pm
|
Well, my memory must have been having some difficulty trying to retrieve 20 year old information. My 45 copy DOES actually end cold with the synthesizer, but I could've sworn it was the fade out version. I must have been remembering the way I heard it on the radio in 1987 with the faded ending.
So, unless new information is presented, here's what we have on 7" singles: - Some DJ copies contained the original mix faded to 4:26 (according to Pat) - Other DJ copies have the remix version faded to 4:23 (Jim's copy) - Commercial copies are all the remixed version running 4:43 (with the cold synthesizer ending) Here's what we have on CD: CDs that fade out to 4:34 are the original mix (vinyl LP version?); this is the version that appears on most discs. Discs running 4:43 have the 45 version: (S) (4:43) Virgin 90573 and 86002 Broadcast (S) (4:43) Hip-O 40080 Essential '80s: 1985-1989 (S) (4:43) Virgin 46589 First Generation - Twenty Five Years Of Virgin Records (S) (4:43) UTV Records 440069612 Pure 80's Love: The #1 Hits Discs running 4:24 have the remixed DJ version: (S) (4:24) EMI 91419 MTV, BET, VH-1 Power Players (S) (4:24) JCI 3186 1985 - Only Love - 1989 Assuming that the mixes are all the same on the discs not listed above (the non-remixed version), those discs should probably contain the comment "LP version" or "neither," depending on which mix appeared on the original vinyl LP for Broadcast. |
Posted By: crapfromthepast
Date Posted: 04 October 2008 at 3:10pm
|
Thought I would revisit this thread, since I've gotten some new CDs in the past year.
I found a CD with the remix, running 4:43, and having cold synth ending: Rock On - Everybody Have Fun Tonight: 1987 (Madacy RO-2-5187, released 1998). It's definitely the remix (no little guitar strum at 0:33, lots of reverb on the snare, break at 3:30 is not that much quieter than rest of song). It runs at 125.13 BPM. Sound on this song is surprisingly good - no compression/limiting or any other nasty artifacts. I also found a copy of Broadcast, with the non-remix version. It fades, much like the common versions described above, and runs 4:38. It's definitely not the remix (little guitar strum at 0:33, not too much reverb on the snare, very quiet break at 3:30). It runs at 124.97 BPM, which doesn't really tell us anything. The matrix number on my Broadcast CD is "86002 01# 03-14-94". The printing on the CD itself is spare black lettering - logo at top "Broadcast" in capital letters at bottom, Virgin and CD logos at right, and "0777 7 86002 2 0 / See booklet for details / (P) 1986 Siren Records, Ltd." at left. So there indeed exists at least one pressing of the Broadcast CD with the non-remix on it. |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 04 October 2008 at 6:29pm
| AHA!!! Great info, CFTP! |
Posted By: abagon
Date Posted: 07 October 2008 at 7:30am
|
I have the U.S. release LP "Broadcast"and the Japan release LP.
I know that the Japan release LP has used the music source of the U.K. "(I Just) Died In Your Arms" on the Japan release is the remix by TIM PALMER (the actual running time is (4:36)). This song on the U.S. release LP "Broadcast" is the remix by SHELLY YAKUS with the synthesizer ending (the actual running time is (4:43) with the listed time "4:41". This is the same as the U.S. commercial 45 that I have. (Virgin 7-99481). The running time (4:43), the listed time "4:41" I think that the various CDs of this song on the data base have the music sources of the U.S. Mix or the U.K. Mix. CFTP's information is very important. Thank you very much. Please see the following 2 scans, The mixers are different each. "Broadcast" LP (Japan release-Label) 
------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------------------- "Broadcast" LP (U.S. release, the half size of the back cover) Sorry for the large scan. 
--abagon |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 07 October 2008 at 7:51am
|
Abagon, that is very interesting new information! Since the UK LP says "remix" by Tim Palmer, does that mean there is another non-remixed version? I like your theory about the many CDs possibly containing the UK mix. Good observation!
CFTP, does your CD copy of Broadcast say anything about Tim Palmer? |
Posted By: bwolfe
Date Posted: 07 October 2008 at 8:18am
|
I still have an unopened 12 inch copy of that one.
It was pressed to look like the logo of the band. In fact it looked more like a saw blade. The multiple copies of that one we got from Virgin were in plastic sleeves with most of them cut by the sharp edges of the vinyl. Appreciate all the info about this one. You guys are the best! ------------- the way it was heard on the radio |
Posted By: abagon
Date Posted: 07 October 2008 at 8:23am
| Hi, aaronk. Thank you very much for your response. But I don't know the non-remix LP/CD. I think the non-remix version equals the music source of the U.K. |
Posted By: crapfromthepast
Date Posted: 07 October 2008 at 8:39am
|
I don't have my Broadcast CD at work, so I can't say whether it mentions who mixed "I Just Died".
I'd take the Tim Palmer reference with a grain of salt. From abagon's scans, we can see that the LP label says that Tim Palmer remixed the song, but the color-coded LP jacket says that Shelly Yakus mixed it. One of those is wrong. |
Posted By: Indy500
Date Posted: 08 October 2008 at 8:41pm
| I found the "extended remix" on the import cd single of One For The Mocking Bird. It runs 6:46 |
Posted By: mstgator
Date Posted: 10 October 2008 at 10:55am
The label scan is from the Japanese release, and the jacket is from the US release. |
Posted By: abagon
Date Posted: 21 January 2009 at 8:05am
|
Pat:
Cutting Crew's "(I Just) Died In Your Arms" has "U.S. mix" and "U.K. mix". Total 50 of CDs' tracks including this song need the comments for CDs of "U.S. mix" or "U.K. mix" on the database. (U.S. mix = the remix by SHELLY YAKUS/U.K. mix = the remix by TIM PALMER.) Although there are many different points between the U.S. mix and the U.K. mix. It's easy to distinguish the difference using the following point best. U.S. mix stands out powerful electric guitar at 3:36. U.K. mix stands out drums than the electric guitar at 3:36. (Behind the lyric of "I just died in your arms tonight (from 3:32 to 3:35)" with only the synthesizer background.) I believe you'll be able to understand it, when you compare the CD "Broadcast" of Virgin 90573 with the same title of Virgin 86002. I think that this work is very hard, Could you make my wish come true? --abagon |
Posted By: Pat Downey
Date Posted: 16 February 2009 at 9:43pm
|
I finally found time to go through all of the cd's that contain (I Just) Died In Your Arms and was able to classify each entry by the appropriate mix (either the Tim Palmer or Shelly Yakus mix). What was most confusing to me is that the U.S. vinyl LP "Broadcast" featured the US mix (the Shelly Yakus mix) while the "Broadcast" cd was issued in two different pressings, one the Shelly Yakus mix (Virgin 90573) and the other is the Tim Palmer mix (Virgin 86002). When I made a statement months ago about my dj 45 not being the remix (Shelly Yakus mix), I really meant that the dj 45 I own was not remixed from the U.S. vinyl LP. Since the Tim Palmer mix was the original mix then yes my dj copy is a remix and so is the US vinyl LP so I apologize for misleading readers.
The only difference I noticed between other readers input and my own research is that I disagree with Aaron when he suggests the mix on the cd JCI 3186 "1985 - Only Love - 1986" is the Shelly Yakus mix. On my cd it is the Tim Palmer original mix with matrix number "10 JCD 3186-2 01" faded :10 early. My guess is that there may be two pressings of this cd as the cd jacket states a time of (4:33) but actually runs (4:24). |
Posted By: abagon
Date Posted: 17 February 2009 at 1:10am
|
I'm so grateful for your hard work concerning the "(I Just) Died In Your Arms". Thank you very much, Pat.
--abagon |
Posted By: aaronk
Date Posted: 17 February 2009 at 6:17am
Pat, while I have the Power Players compilation with the Shelly Yakus mix, I admittedly was assuming that Only Love also contained the same version since the times were the same. I'm glad you finally had time to review all of the CDs to verify for sure which mix is on each. |