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Top Pop Singles Vol.1 (1955-89) |
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jebsib ![]() Music Fan ![]() Joined: 06 April 2006 Status: Offline Points: 16 |
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Paul, what source did you use for Canadian #1's? Wikipedia almost exclusively
cites "RPM", whereas Billboard printed "The Record" in their magazine. Never certain what is 'official'. |
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Paul Haney ![]() Music Fan ![]() ![]() Joined: 01 April 2005 Status: Offline Points: 43 |
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I'll have to double-check with Joel (he compiled the list). But I believe he used the CHUM charts from 1957-64 and the RPM charts from 1965-89. |
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PopArchivist ![]() Music Fan ![]() ![]() Joined: 30 June 2018 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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It had to change. When you had massive airplay hits like Don't Speak, Iris which never charted you basically are not properly representing what was on radio and massive at the time. While I don't like today's album bombs the practice really did not start until Taylor Swift's Fearless. If there is one thing I would fix, it would be making sure entire albums cant chart at once, only the songs meant to be the promoted singles at the time they are promoted by the label. For me a better division of the books that reflects the Hot 100 change would be 1955-1998 and 1999-2021, but oh well I don't make the decisions! |
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Favorite two expressions to live by on this board: "You can't download vinyl" and "Not everything is available on CD."
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Chartman ![]() Music Fan ![]() Joined: 26 February 2016 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Back in 1973 I bought my first RR publication "1955-
1972 Top Pop Singles". It was a paperback book, yellow cover, and cost a whopping $30 ($184 in today's dollars)! Had to save all my allowance and paper route money. I have bought every Top Pop Singles since, but that will stop with this new edition. I understand the need to break the book up into volumes, but Joel's vision of using 1989 as the break point is silliness. I view this book as a final edition for these years so it will never be updated - only Volume 2 will be updated going forward. I would have chosen a break date where the Hot 100 significantly changed. There could be debate over which date, but some have suggested 12/5/98. This was the beginning of the all-genre chart (in comparison to a Pop chart) and the demise of the availability of a single to purchase requirement. I have no qualms with Billboard's decision, but the composition of the Hot 100 significantly changed that date and it's a natural cut-off date for a book that is based on the Hot 100. The 1990 Hot 100 was exactly like the the 1989 Hot 100. If you compare today's Hot 100 with those from the 60s-80s the only characteristic they have in common is 100 positions. During the past three months the twitter feed @Army_Connect has single handily made "Butter" by BTS the #1 song on the Hot 100. WTF. So now we have the following situation for music charts: 7/27/40-7/28/58 - combination of Pop charts (Sales, Airplay, Juke Box) 8/4/58-8/29/98 - Hot 100 Pop charts 9/5/98-current date - Hot 100 all-genre charts Maybe Volume 1 could be called "Top Pop Singles 1940- 1998" and Volume 2 titled "Hot 100 Singles 1998-2021". While I still have tremendous respect for Joel (and have donated mucho dinero to RR coffers), he is wrong here. On a side note, I really hate when Billboard compares modern chart achievements with those from pre-1998. Definitely apples to oranges. Edited by Chartman |
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Chartman ![]() Music Fan ![]() Joined: 26 February 2016 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Current situation reminds me of two other instances
with RR books. The initial "Pop Memories 1890-1954" contained the following combined sections: 1890-1940 - manufactured chart data from a variety of sources 1940-1954 - manufactured data plus actual data from Billboard's Pop charts (Sales, Airplay, and Juke Boxes). This book always bothered me because the 1940-1954 data was a mix of facts and opinion. Joel's vision wasn't correct then and later RR updated the book as "Pop Memories 1900-1940". Now it makes perfect sense as none of the book's data was derived from an official Billboard Singles chart. The book "Hot Country Songs 1944-2012" incorporated data from the new and improved (many say f*cked up) Hot Country Songs chart Billboard revealed on 10/20/12. That was another RR mistake but fortunately corrected in "Hot Country Songs 1944-2017" book as the Country Airplay chart from 10/20/12 onwards was used as the "official book" chart. The same philosophy applies to the R&B charts but wasn't incorporated in the "Top R&B Singles 1942-2016" book. Maybe future editions will use the R&B/Hip-Hop Airplay as the official book chart. While I appreciate the added features found in the new Top Pop Singles, they do not provide much more than what is contained in the 2018 edition. The charts the past 3 year have really been "interesting" but not in a good way. Suspect Billboard will be changing their formulas and rules again. I wish Joel and Paul all the best, but with this latest Pop Singles Volume 1 choice and my disappointment with the "Rock Tracks 1981-2020" (mentioned awhile ago), I'm afraid this loyal customer is no more. Edited by Chartman |
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Paul C ![]() Music Fan ![]() Joined: 23 October 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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What alternated for two months (May and June of 2005) was that one week the Hot 100 would encompass a full page and the Pop 100 half a page, and the next week the Pop 100 would be a full page and the Hot 100 half a page. This proved to be extremely unpopular, and after only two months, Billboard went back to giving the Hot 100 a full page every week. The four weeks that the Hot 100 was only a half page were May 7, May 21, June 4, and June 18, 2005. In these four issues, the Hot 100 contained no writer or producer credits. The Pop 100 existed from 2005 until 2010 (in its last year it was available only online). Its methodology was essentially the same as the Hot 100, except that the airplay component was based solely on Top 40 airplay. Its methodology was actually very similar to that of the Hot 100 from November 1991 until November 1998. |
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Paul C ![]() Music Fan ![]() Joined: 23 October 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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RPM was published from 1964 until 2000. The Record published charts from 1983 until 2001. There was no national Canadian chart prior to 1964. Unfortunately, some people treat the CHUM chart from 1957-64 as the Canadian chart, but this is like treating the chart of a New York station as the American chart. (In both 1966 and 1967, a song reached #1 on the CHUM chart without even making the Top 40 nationally.) |
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Hykker ![]() Music Fan ![]() Joined: 30 October 2007 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 24 |
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I agree with you to a point, but I'd imagine the decision to use 1989 as the cutoff was chosen as a mid-point in the rock era. Since when was the Hot 100 ever a pop-only chart? I think you're blaming the messenger here...it's not RR's fault that BB took so long to acknowledge that a song could be a hit without being released as a single. Yeah, the current charts are a mess, personally IMHO the concept of a "Hot 100" is an anachronism. There really are no across-the-board hits anymore.
So what would you do instead? Even if it was possible to collate charts from every key Canadian station pre- 1964 to create a pseudo-national chart, radio charts are subjective by definition. Maybe a better option is to ignore Canadian hits older than '64? |
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PopArchivist ![]() Music Fan ![]() ![]() Joined: 30 June 2018 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 36 |
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If you want to argue in favor for 1989 as a cut off, you can look at it like Whitburn does as the end of the vinyl 45 age and the dawn of the Cassette/CD Promo/CD/Digital download era which is from 1990 on. Today's Hot 100 is a hot mess of songs from all backgrounds, pop, country, r & b, hip hop etc. Not for the better. Plus the crazy album drops and of course whether something gets streamed on Tik Tok or Youtube factors in. I miss the days when a hit was a hit. Now whole albums are a hit and the latest youtube sensation is a hit too... |
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Favorite two expressions to live by on this board: "You can't download vinyl" and "Not everything is available on CD."
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Chartman ![]() Music Fan ![]() Joined: 26 February 2016 Status: Offline Points: 3 |
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Obviously C&W and R&B songs made the Hot 100 since it's inception, but as crossover hits, i.e. C&W and R&B songs that were played on Pop Stations. Starting with the 12/5/98 chart Billboard not only increased the percentage of charts points from radio play, but they also increased the number and TYPE of radio stations surveyed. Consequently many songs that received airplay on C&W and R&B stations only (and not pop) made the chart (unlike before) and would not be considered as crossover hits. That's a significant change. Per Joel Whitburn Top Pop Singles 1955-2002 page xi "December 5, 1998, the date that Billboard introduced its MOST REVISED revised Hot 100 EVER" and Top Pop Singles 1955-2018 page 5 "On December 5, 1998, Billboard debuted a completely revised Hot 100, which included, for the first time, songs that were not commercially available as singles. The revised chart now included ALL FORMATS of music, so Country, Latin and Christian music were well represented on the Hot 100 and Bubbling Under charts". This marked the end of the old 1958-1998 Hot 100. A quick look at the 12/5/98 chart shows that "I'm Your Angel" by R. Kelly & Celine Dion had been on the new Hot 100 (test charts) for 6 weeks and jumped from 46 to 1. This was the first appearance on the Hot 100 so what kind of chart run would this song have had under the old format? "From This Moment On" by Shania Twain had been on the new Hot 100 for 27 weeks and jumped from 34 to 5. This was its first appearance (although the song had been on the Airplay chart for quite some time) on the Hot 100. Whitburn notes in his "Billboard Hot 100 Charts, The Nineties "On this date, Billboard DRAMATICALLY revised their Hot 100-compilation methodology". Edited by Chartman |
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