Grass Roots - Where Were You When

Aaron, I posed that very question on the xmfan chat board when the song was played during the final airing of XM's "IT" top 40 marathon back in 2007. The only thing that seemed to emerge was that the original demo - with P.F. Sloan's lead vocal - was first aired on Burbank's KBLA. The positive reaction convinced Dunhill that it might have a hit on its hands, but the company refused to allow Phil and Steve Barri go out on tour as the Grass Roots, since they were signed as songwriters. Enter the ex-Bedouins, and theirs was the single.   To my ears, I could've sworn that it was Phil's lead on Dunhill 4029, but I read an interview a few years back in which he insisted that it was, in fact, Bill Fulton's lead on the 45. The clip that ran on Dick Clark's Where The Action Is TV show featured Fulton lip-synching with the rest of the short-lived second 'Roots lineup.

I bought the stereo Let's Live For Today LP when it was released in 1967, and immediately detected a difference, although I didn't have the ability to compare it with the 45 in those days. Grill seemed to attack the song like a scythe, compared to Fulton's smooth delivery.

The Anthology 1965-1975 CD does feature the same vocal as the 45, but the extra reverb on the stereo mix really robs the track of its punch.

Rob Grill's slower (and smoother) 1979 solo remake from Uprooted was issued as a single on Mercury 76078.

Soooo.... who sang lead on the earlier "Mr. Jones", then? :)

BTW: I have both the DJ and stock Dunhill 4029 45. They're identical. The demo never made it to wax or any other L.A. radio outlet beyond KBLA.

Edited by Yah Shure

The other reason I'd incorrectly assumed it was Phil's lead on the 45 was his original version of "A Melody For You" (Dunhill 4054), which preceded the version issued by the Grass Roots on Dunhill 4122. The instrumental backing tracks aren't the same; the 'Roots version has a much more polished break than Phil's original. But one thing is obvious: Phil's vocal on "Melody" is an uncanny dead-ringer for Bill Fulton's on "Where Were You."

Actually, that very close similarity in voices may explain why there's so much confusion over the "Where Were You" lead vocals.   

Edited by Yah Shure

Aaron,I have the Varese Vintage CD reissue of the Where Were You When I Needed You album (with bonus tracks) and it's the same as the stereo Fulton version on the Rhino Anthology CD. There's no other version of the song on the CD.

Edited by Yah Shure

P.F. Sloan has stated on the Forgotten Hits website that he never sang on the song Where Were You When I needed You. There are two commercial versions, the Fulton version and the Grill version. There is no phantom third version with Sloan's vocals....unless you count his original demo recording of the song, which was just him and a guitar, not a full production (and his voice on it only slightly resembles Bill Fulton's take on the song).

Yes, Sloan sang on Mr. Jones as well as some of the other singles and album tracks. If Dunhill didn't want him to sing lead on the songs because he couldn't tour behind them, why issue the songs as The Grass Roots to begin with?

For what it's worth, the Forgotten Hits website has been unable to track down Bill Fulton to get his side of the story...

Edited by TomDiehl1

Right, the references upthread about the Let's Live For Today vinyl LP were specifically about the version of "Where Were You" with Rob Grill's new vocal, which made its first appearance on that album, and not that album's title track.

Adding to the confusion regarding who sang lead on the "Where Were You" single is this statement from Andrew Sandoval's liner notes on the Varese Vintage Where Were You When I Needed You CD:

In May of 1966, Dunhill released a preview single from the album, Sloan & Barri's original 1965 recording of "Where Were You When I Needed You." Although the recording had been sitting around for the better part of a year, this did not hinder the song's obvious chart potential and the record became the Grass Roots' first top 40 hit in June of '66.

It seems Phil Sloan has made contradictory statements about exactly who did the honors. In the interview I'd read where Sloan insisted Fulton had sung lead, he'd reinforced his assertion by adding that the sheet music for the song featured a photo of the Fulton lineup of the band. Perhaps this one is destined to remain a mystery.   

Tom, I never said that Dunhill didn't want him (Phil) to sing lead on the songs because he couldn't tour behind them. I said that Dunhill didn't want the duo to tour, which would have taken them away from their songwriting and production duties. There was never any issue about who sang on the records. As much as Phil and Steve wanted to be an actual working band as the Grass Roots, you can't blame Dunhill for insisting that the duo concentrate on what they'd been hired to do: write songs and produce. It was Dunhill's suggestion that if Sloan & Barri wanted an actual Grass Roots, then they should go find an actual band to be the Grass Roots. That aspect wasn't tied to who performed on the records. The label obviously didn't have the same concerns regarding Phil issuing his own solo records on Dunhill. Although it wasn't an ideal scratch for Sloan & Barri's own creative itch, it did mean they'd have a band to write for and produce that was also free to go on the road.

Edited by Yah Shure